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Message: <blockquote data-quote="JohnSnow" data-source="post: 4028366" data-attributes="member: 32164">Okay, let's actually try some real reverse engineering. Here are the relevant lines from Ampersand: The Devil's in the DetailsOkay, we know from Races and Classes that every class gets "a single level-based modifier that applies to all of your character's attacks, defenses, and skill checks. All 10th-level characters have a +5 bonus to AC, all three defenses, attacks, and so on." Assuming this applies to monsters as well, the Spined Devil should get a +3 to all of its attacks, defenses, and skills just for being 6th-level, whereas the Pit Fiend should get a +13 just for being 26th-level.The interesting thing is that some of the Pit Fiend's attribute bonuses work just fine with the old bonuses if you assume they're basically untrained skill checks. For example, a Charisma 28 (+9 + 13 for level = +22).That said, the Defenses work out as follows (I'll get to AC in a minute):FORT 42 = 10 (base) + 13 (26th-level) + 8 (CON 27) + 11REF 38 = 10 (base) + 13 (26th-level) + 7 (DEX 24) + 8WILL 40 = 10 (base) + 13 (26th-level) + 5 (WIS 20) + 12Those last numbers seem pretty random. If we conduct this same reverse-engineering on the 6th-level Spined Devil, we get:FORT 18 = 10 (base) + 3 (6th-level) + 2 (CON 14) + 3REF 18 = 10 (base) + 3 (6th-level) + 2 (DEX 15) + 3WILL 18 = 10 (base) + 3 (6th-level) + 2 (WIS 14) + 3This is interesting. It seems that the Spined Devil gets +3 to all its defenses just because. But, if we assume that devils get to add their base CHA bonus to all their defenses (just for being devils...it fits with the Paladin's divine grace), then our Spined Devil skirmisher is only getting +1 "just because." Which is a totally believable amount for  the "skirmisher."Our Pit Fiend has a +9 CHA bonus. Factoring that in, we have:FORT 42 = 10 (base) + 13 (26th-level) + 8 (CON 27) + 9 (CHA 28) + 2 (misc.)REF 38 = 10 (base) + 13 (26th-level) + 7 (DEX 24) + 9 (CHA 28) - 1 (misc.)WILL 40 = 10 (base) + 13 (26th-level) + 5 (WIS 20) + 9 (CHA 28) + 3 (misc.)The - 1 to REF makes sense: the Pit Fiend is Large (-1 Size penalty).So, here's my guess: Between being a Soldier and Leader, he gets a FORT +2, REF +0 and WILL +3. Now, let's go back to AC.For the Spined Devil, I get:AC 20 = 18 (REF Defense) + 2 (undetermined bonus)Now, for the Pit Fiend:AC 44 = 38 (REF Defense) + 6 (undetermined bonus)In the Spined Devil's case, that's probably natural armor. For the Pit Fiend, it could be a combination of natural armor and its breastplate.All this is just speculation, of course. And some math.</blockquote>

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