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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Edena_of_Neith" data-source="post: 367872" data-attributes="member: 2020">A comment here:  It would seem to me that the word Stature is the word that best applies to many things in Middle Earth.  For example, when a hobbit makes a sword, it is a sword.  When a dwarf makes a sword, it is a really, really fine sword, because dwarves are really, really fine sword-makers.  When a Noldorian Elf makes a sword, it is a + 3 to + 5 magical weapon.    Not because the elf is skilled in sword-making (although he might well be skilled) but because he has Stature.  Frodo's mithril armor was made by the dwarves, who infused their magic in it, and it would withstand blows that no normal mail could hope to withstand (in the film, it could protect it's wearer from the force of blows, as well as their piercing capabilities.)  However, Frodo's sword, Sting, was made by the Noldor, and by the mere fact they made the thing, it is powerful, gleams when orcs are about, and will sheer through things other blades cannot (such as the webs of Shelob.)  It was this Stature that made the Noldor capable of taking on Morgoth, and crushing his armies in the Battle Under the Stars and the Glorious Battle.  It was this Stature that enabled the Noldor to partially withstand Morgoth in the great Battle of Sudden Flame.  (If Morgoth had been around in Frodo's time, and he had unleashed a force like the force unleashed in the Battle of Sudden Flame upon Gondor, Lothlorien, Dale, etc., it would have been all over.  Over.  Finis.  And the finis would have been a matter of only a few days.)  Unfortunately, orcs have Stature as well.  And that Stature can be INCREASED, if Sauron puts forth his power to will it, and Sauron does just that, in ROTK.  Of course, some orcs will always have lesser stature, and the maggots (the orcs of Moria, as Ugluk likes to call them) have less Stature than the Apes of Lugburz (as Ugluk calls the orcs of Mordor.)  Even more unfortunately, the Stature of the Nazgul can be increased, and their Stature does increase - GREATLY - in TTT, and then increases greatly again in ROTK.  In FOTR, the Lord of the Nazgul walks through Bree, and everyone shivers at a sudden fear and stays indoors.  In ROTK, if the Lord of the Nazgul had walked though Bree, EVERYONE in Bree would have either:  Run, and kept running until they fell from exhaustion (those of strong heart.)  Thrown themselves on the ground, and thought only of hiding, and crawling, and weeping (if they were typical Breelanders.)  Killed themselves in their fear (if they were weaker of heart.)  And here is where the Ring comes in.  If Sauron regains the Ring, he regains Stature.  His Nazgul, have their stature MASSIVELY increased (to paraphrase Gandalf:  they are only a shadow of the terror and power they would possess if the Ring was on their Master's Hand once again.)  His orcs would massively increase in stature.  Everyone serving Sauron (such as the Men of Rhun and Harad) would have a sudden increase in stature, not to mention Sauron's domination over their minds would become much more complete.  Gil Galad and Elendil and their forces had the Stature to face Sauron and the Ring.  The Free World does not have that kind of Stature in it anymore, so if Sauron gets the Ring, finis for Middle Earth.  So, Gandalf the White rides against the Nazgul, and he pits his strength against theirs, and here it is a question of Stature.  The Nazgul decide this version of Gandalf is too much for them, and decide to let their leader deal with him instead.  For what it's worth, Frodo gained Stature during the story.  Frodo gained a vast amount of Stature - enough that perhaps he could be accounted one of the Wise, in the end.  Saruman saw it, and even respected it, before the end, whereas the hobbits could not perceive what had happened.  - - -  So no, the elves do not use magic per se.  Galadriel pointed out to Frodo that she did not understand what he meant by magic, and confused what the elves did with what the servants of the enemy did, and called them both by that name.  Galadriel's Mirror was the product Stature.  Galadriel's sudden overawing appearance (both in the book and especially in the film) is the result of manifested Stature.  Caras Galadon was built because the elves had the Stature to do so.  Gondolin was the great city it was, because the Noldor were mighty in Stature.  Barad-Dur is the colossal fortress IT is, because of the Stature of Sauron.  To a lesser extent, Dwarrowdelve is the magnificent city it is because of dwarven Stature, but it would be much more appropriate to say:  Dwarrowdelve is the magnificent city it is, because the dwarves built it that way, being the greatest of underground craftsmen.  Stature applies less to dwarves by far than to even Nandirian elves, much less Noldorian elves.  Stature applies to most men less than it even does to dwarves.  The Numenorians once had great Stature, almost equal to the Noldor, but they threw it all away over centuries of foolish thinking, and even more foolish deeds.  The Dunedain inherited the remnant of the Stature of the Numenorians, but they too slowly threw it away, until Arnor passed into history and Gondor dwindled into a ghostly shadow of what it had been.  Yet Aragorn still had Stature, and much of this came from his genuine reverence for, and understanding of, the reality of the West and the folly of his kinsmen.  That Stature enabled Aragorn to defeat Lurtz (in my opinion, at least), and it helped Aragorn win the Battle of the Pelennor Fields, and Aragorn's Stature was one of the key reasons why he could contest with Sauron for the Palantir, and why Sauron became afraid and went to war prematurely.  As for the One Ring:  the greater the Stature of the person wearing it, the greater the power it conferred to that person, and the greater the lure of the Ring to that person (and, if the One Ring was actively used, the faster the corruption of that person.)  As Boromir finally realized, the Stature of the One Ring was greater than his own, and greater than any being who was not Sauron's equal in Stature - such as Tom Bombadil (Stature is why Bombadil could tell Willow Trees to go to sleep, and they did.  Tom Bombadil's Stature is why he could tell Barrow-Wights to go away, and THEY did.)  It's all about Stature.  Trying to fit Stature with the D&D magic system is like putting a square block into a circle sized hole.  It won't work.  (For that matter, roleplaying in Middle Earth won't work, unless everyone plays characters of comparable Stature.  Why play a human or dwarf when the elf over there can do everything bigger and better by default?)</blockquote>

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