Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Rocket your D&D 5E and Level Up: Advanced 5E games into space! Alpha Star Magazine Is Launching... Right Now!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Platemail sold here for CHEAP!!
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="OneWinged4ngel" data-source="post: 4320813" data-attributes="member: 37292"><p>Which is, of course, stupid reasoning. Yay. They took the terrible 3rd ed armor system and, instead of fixing the glaring issues, decided to just make it out that they did it all on purpose, set up the sets by class, and say that there's *supposed* to be a downright best choice for you to pick out. A pattern that one sees throughout lots of 4e, really. They tend to avoid or justify old problems when they don't just outright axe features. It's like they're too lazy to actually try to *fix* things, so they narrow the system down and restrict choices to a point that any dimwit could do it. And then they STILL come up with stuff like Cascade of Blades. The worst part is that in the pursuit of this "easy balance," they're willing to axe any beneficial feature that stands in their way, as well as say "you're supposed to have a best way to build." Since when was that balance? Balance was when I had all the options, but I couldn't make the decision because all the options were similarly attractive, though unique. Not when I got to pick Mithral Breastplate again because it turns out that it's by far the best armor for my given class.</p><p></p><p>Of course, the argument could easily be made that there's good reason that they made the system far more restrictive, despite all the early evidence that it was going in the opposite direction (with things like ToB having easily the best multiclassing in 3rd edition, for example). Harder to homebrew, harder to make unique concepts... easier to sell you new supplements for every new character concept.</p><p></p><p>It's entirely possible that WotC wasn't just taking the lazy way out, they were just taking the greedy way out. Neither possibility makes me feel any better about the company, however. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f641.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":(" title="Frown :(" data-smilie="3"data-shortname=":(" /></p><p></p><p></p><p>Problem being, the game suffers blatantly obvious shortcomings when it comes to the primary purpose of the genre of games known as "pen and paper roleplaying games." The purpose of a roleplaying game isn't just to have a game that you can roleplay in. You can, quite literally, roleplay in ANY game. I can roleplay while playing the Warhammer Fantasy Miniatures game, but that doesn't mean that it's the same category of game as the Warhammer Fantasy Role Playing Game.</p><p></p><p>The purpose of the pen and paper roleplaying game is primarily serve the purpose of resolving and facilitating the story. That's what characterizes that classification of games. If a rule hinders or restricts storytelling, it's a bad rule. Making suspension of belief significantly harder and restricting creative freedom is a negative aspect.</p><p></p><p>It's just a game, and it's a game that has many flaws. It goes far beyond this. These little discrepancies build up very noticeably in 4e, even moreso than in 3rd.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I can think of a dozen ways to solve that off the top of my head other than changing the price to a pittance in a grandstand deus ex machina. Why can't WotC?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="OneWinged4ngel, post: 4320813, member: 37292"] Which is, of course, stupid reasoning. Yay. They took the terrible 3rd ed armor system and, instead of fixing the glaring issues, decided to just make it out that they did it all on purpose, set up the sets by class, and say that there's *supposed* to be a downright best choice for you to pick out. A pattern that one sees throughout lots of 4e, really. They tend to avoid or justify old problems when they don't just outright axe features. It's like they're too lazy to actually try to *fix* things, so they narrow the system down and restrict choices to a point that any dimwit could do it. And then they STILL come up with stuff like Cascade of Blades. The worst part is that in the pursuit of this "easy balance," they're willing to axe any beneficial feature that stands in their way, as well as say "you're supposed to have a best way to build." Since when was that balance? Balance was when I had all the options, but I couldn't make the decision because all the options were similarly attractive, though unique. Not when I got to pick Mithral Breastplate again because it turns out that it's by far the best armor for my given class. Of course, the argument could easily be made that there's good reason that they made the system far more restrictive, despite all the early evidence that it was going in the opposite direction (with things like ToB having easily the best multiclassing in 3rd edition, for example). Harder to homebrew, harder to make unique concepts... easier to sell you new supplements for every new character concept. It's entirely possible that WotC wasn't just taking the lazy way out, they were just taking the greedy way out. Neither possibility makes me feel any better about the company, however. :( Problem being, the game suffers blatantly obvious shortcomings when it comes to the primary purpose of the genre of games known as "pen and paper roleplaying games." The purpose of a roleplaying game isn't just to have a game that you can roleplay in. You can, quite literally, roleplay in ANY game. I can roleplay while playing the Warhammer Fantasy Miniatures game, but that doesn't mean that it's the same category of game as the Warhammer Fantasy Role Playing Game. The purpose of the pen and paper roleplaying game is primarily serve the purpose of resolving and facilitating the story. That's what characterizes that classification of games. If a rule hinders or restricts storytelling, it's a bad rule. Making suspension of belief significantly harder and restricting creative freedom is a negative aspect. It's just a game, and it's a game that has many flaws. It goes far beyond this. These little discrepancies build up very noticeably in 4e, even moreso than in 3rd. I can think of a dozen ways to solve that off the top of my head other than changing the price to a pittance in a grandstand deus ex machina. Why can't WotC? [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Platemail sold here for CHEAP!!
Top