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Message: <blockquote data-quote="bert1001 fka bert1000" data-source="post: 9811090" data-attributes="member: 7029588">I think one of the issues is that in combat there are some clearly defined player skill areas, at minimum:1) where to move2) what target to select3) which ability to use (some of which are limited resources)The level to which these player skill choices matter varies, but in general I would say the bulk of the "outcome" is still character skill and rng.   Especially after establishing at least a fairly medium level of player skill competency which most people can achieve.   Yes, a very skilled player can gain some advantages but it does not overwhelm the medium skill player with the same character.   (perhaps the character building player skill game is more differentiated however but I think that is a separate topic).For combat, the kind of player skill being tested is basically tied to strategic gaming -- maximizing actions, targeting weaknesses, building combos, selecting the right game ability for the job, etc.    It's a skill that anyone can build some expertise in and are presumably a bit interested in if playing a game like D&D.  What is the equivalent player skill being asked for non combat encounters?It's less well defined, partly because the non combat resolution systems are so poor and neglected in D&D.    One roll resolution, with DM fiat on when the goal is met or if additional one roll skill checks are needed.   What is the equivalent gaming player skill?Whatever the player skill is I don't think it should count any more than combat player skill (moderate at most) and should probably be tied to strategic gaming choices and not acting, real world knowledge or charisma, or rule ignoring/breaking creativity.   D&D doesn't give you a lot of support for how to include player skill in non combat however.</blockquote>

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