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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ThirdWizard" data-source="post: 3861054" data-attributes="member: 12037">Right. So, the question is, do we change these core assumptions that were introduced in 3.5 or do we remove Save or Die because they don't mesh with the new core assumptions.Obviously, the 4e designers have decided to keep the new assumptions and remove save or die, probably replacing it with some different, more malleable effects. Since I like these newly introduced default assumptions of the game, I'm all for the removal of the SoD.I don't think a mechanical aspect of the game should be balanced using play style preferences. To me, constant dying at high levels due to SoD was always just the way 3e was when I first got there. Since, I have pretty much removed SoD, but I still think of high level 3e games as a game where you're supposed to drop a PC every encounter. To me, that's just the way the game is built. In other words, is is so prevalent (+ easy resurrection), I've never considered it something to be avoided in the way you're talking about.Plus, I run a lot of exploration, going out into the great unknown. That's part of what draws me to Planescape. I have fond memories of PCs walking through a portal into a dark cavern and tossing a torch down a cliff only to have it land on a white dragon's head. Or going to fight some axiomatic illithids to find that a former ally (a wizard) had allied herself with the mind flayers and aiding the battle. Not that PCs never know what to expect, they prepare quite a bit, but implying that you can never use a wizard in a surprise encounter is just a too much for me to swallow.Sure, but that's much rarer and more based on luck than anything. My problem isn't so much that PCs can die without having a chance to act, its more that with particular monsters/spells/abilities its almost always going to happen. Instead of "Wow, that orc got a critical on you!" every once in a while it's "Roll a 10 or die" for a few rounds. And, of course, there's the paper tiger effect. Bodaks, without SoD are amazingly weak, so if you use death ward they're pushovers.</blockquote>

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