Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Remathilis" data-source="post: 3865830" data-attributes="member: 7635">How many monsters can kill a PC in one blow (excluding crits?) on the opening round?A brief comparisonBecause I like 8th level and our friend the bodak, we'll use them both. Now to find a group of 8th level PCs and an 8th level melee monster...Ah, Stone Giant (CR 8)So a barbarian8, a paladin8, a cleric8, a rogue8, and a sorcerer8 (all the major HD represented) encounter these two creatures. Lets assume they have little proper foreknowledge of the challenge, to avoid the chess analogy. Just raw stats vs. monsters. Neither monster is advanced in any way, and the PCs are using the human DMG averages to save me a lot of time. The barbarian has 73 hp, 19 AC, and +8 Fort Save. Since this is the surprise round, he can't rage. Against the bodak (fort DC 15, he must roll a 7 or higher to survive. Thats a 35% failure rate). The Stone Giant makes his one attack (surprise round, standard action) with a +12 to hit (vs AC 19, only a 7 to hit, or 35% chance of missing) but does 2d8+12 damage (14-28 damage. Vs. that 73 hp, he's not dropping that round.) Even on a crit (28-56 damage) he's not dying in one blow. The paladin has 56 hp, 21 AC, and a +10 Fort Save (yay divine grace!) The bodak's gaze is avoided on a 5 or higher (25% mortality rate). The Giant can hit him on a 9 or better (45% miss chance). His damage scale (14-28) won't kill the paladin, and a maximum critical will merely stagger him. Again, the bodak has a better chance of outright killing him. The cleric has 55 hp, 21 AC, and a +8 Fort. The bodak has a slightly better chance of killing him than the paladin (35% miss chance, equal to barbarian). The giant has the same chance to hit him as he does the paladin (25%) and again, can't kill him on a single blow. A maximum crit would drop him to -1. The rogue has 38 hp, 19 AC, and a +3 Fort. The bodak has a great chance of killing him (12 or better, 60% chance) while the giant (35% chance to miss) can't do enough damage in one blow to down him either (though pretty close). A crit however would (bringing him well below -10).The poor sorcerer has 30 hp 14 AC, and a +3 Fort. His chances vs. the bodak are the same (60%) as the rogues. His low AC (10% miss chance) makes him a clear target, but get this, Even Mr. d4 CAN'T DIE FROM A SINGLE HIT (he has 2 hp left). Sure, a crit will splatter him, but that's my point. So each time the bodak jumped out, there was a 25% to 60% chance of death. The Stone Giant COULD NOT KILL a single 8th level PC in one roll. (He'd have to crit to outright kill the rogue or sorcerer, drop the cleric, or stagger the paladin, he couldn't even drop the barbarian BEFORE rage). And as we all know, a crit from a greatclub (20/x2) is not really that common (5% to threat, normal % to confirm). So in essence, the Stone Giant has a 5% chance of killing or dropping any but the barbarian in one "hit" while the bodak is shooting at 25-60%. Both are CR 8. And that's why SoD is broken.</blockquote>

Verification