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Players establishing facts about the world impromptu during play
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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 8262899" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>This is a good (and very inferable) response.</p><p></p><p>But I don't agree that the analogy (climbing to grappling to improv jazz to TTRPGing) is inapt. Like at all.</p><p></p><p>And I don't agree that its the difference between cooking and eating.</p><p></p><p>I'm sure your cognitive orientation to what is happening is exactly as you're describing it above, meaning the experiential component for you is as you say. But I don't agree that the dynamics of the curation process between the two is fundamentally discrete/exclusive. Now, like I said above, the Skilled Play component will be impacted under a certain configuration of discovery vs creation in TTRPGing (which is why "The Czege Principle" is absolutely an axiom of challenge-based play). But the fundamental nature of creation (cooking) and discovery (eating) in TTRPGing don't have to be discrete things. And it doesn't have to impact Skilled Play.</p><p></p><p>Here is an example:</p><p></p><p>* I'm running Moldvay Basic (therefore my players are playing it).</p><p></p><p>* I get a configuration of a Wandering Monsters roll (x) + Monster Reaction ( y ) that is completely unorthodox (for both the setting and a homogenous perspective on this creatures orientation).</p><p></p><p>* Now I have to come up with a "just in time" creation of (a) why the Monster is here at all (so I have to explain their existence and frame the situation around it entirely) and (b) why this instantiation of this Monster would be oriented toward the PCs in such a non-canonical way.</p><p></p><p></p><p>This configuration requires both <strong>cooking </strong>(the creation of the situation) and the <strong>eating </strong>(the discovery of the implications on setting/mythology) to take place simultaneously. I'm creating this content and I'm discovery something new about the world at the exact same moment and my players are making the same discovery. "Wow, under rare circumstances the rare Wight can retain a redemptive memory of their past life and have it manifest such that it subverts their evil nature so they answer a plea for help from an injured creature."</p><p></p><p>Creation + Discovery are happening simultaneously and the players still have to deal with whatever puzzle/obstacle I've put before them (so Skilled Play in the challenge-based dungeon-as-obstacle course sense is kept intact).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 8262899, member: 6696971"] This is a good (and very inferable) response. But I don't agree that the analogy (climbing to grappling to improv jazz to TTRPGing) is inapt. Like at all. And I don't agree that its the difference between cooking and eating. I'm sure your cognitive orientation to what is happening is exactly as you're describing it above, meaning the experiential component for you is as you say. But I don't agree that the dynamics of the curation process between the two is fundamentally discrete/exclusive. Now, like I said above, the Skilled Play component will be impacted under a certain configuration of discovery vs creation in TTRPGing (which is why "The Czege Principle" is absolutely an axiom of challenge-based play). But the fundamental nature of creation (cooking) and discovery (eating) in TTRPGing don't have to be discrete things. And it doesn't have to impact Skilled Play. Here is an example: * I'm running Moldvay Basic (therefore my players are playing it). * I get a configuration of a Wandering Monsters roll (x) + Monster Reaction ( y ) that is completely unorthodox (for both the setting and a homogenous perspective on this creatures orientation). * Now I have to come up with a "just in time" creation of (a) why the Monster is here at all (so I have to explain their existence and frame the situation around it entirely) and (b) why this instantiation of this Monster would be oriented toward the PCs in such a non-canonical way. This configuration requires both [B]cooking [/B](the creation of the situation) and the [B]eating [/B](the discovery of the implications on setting/mythology) to take place simultaneously. I'm creating this content and I'm discovery something new about the world at the exact same moment and my players are making the same discovery. "Wow, under rare circumstances the rare Wight can retain a redemptive memory of their past life and have it manifest such that it subverts their evil nature so they answer a plea for help from an injured creature." Creation + Discovery are happening simultaneously and the players still have to deal with whatever puzzle/obstacle I've put before them (so Skilled Play in the challenge-based dungeon-as-obstacle course sense is kept intact). [/QUOTE]
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