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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Nameless1" data-source="post: 5292017" data-attributes="member: 83379">So there are several things that don't fit for me in your post. First, your post assumes a mercenery style campaign. One with the stock stadard cliched D&D tropes. I actually never play these style games. Second, I always cut the "find the adventure" crap out of my games. We have a plan for play before we sit down at the table. Characters are made with the plan in mind. I find wandering around waiting for the GM to finally give me a hook to be very boring. I have never read any fantasy literature that started with a motley group of mercenaries sitting in a pub, asking around about where the adventure is. It is a different play style, but I find it saves tons of time and gets to the good stuff without any frustration.Third, all of the most interesting stories are created out of relationships of protagonists with other people. Pre establishied relationships are the building blocks of good stories. sitting in a bar is one way to establish relationships, but as I discovered early in life, bars are poor places to establish relationships with interesting and important people. I quit going to them, and I see no reason besides pub food for why my characters would be interested in them. The "we meet in a tavern" cliche is tired, and deserves to be drug out into the street and shot. With a spoon. When you outline more advanced character goals, you seem to start at nothing. I like to have a my characters have a little more involvement in the world before we even start play, that way I can hit them where it hurts. Characters with no roots cannot be hurt. You should always hurt the characters. How they handle it is the story.For full disclosure, I don't think that I have played D&D in about 2 years. I have played a bunch of indie games. And I guess I should say that I may be overreacting to your post. You may be just using D&D cliches because everyone understands them. But the thing that Merkuri is commenting on is the fact that he dislikes the D&D cliche of "we all meet in a bar" with no plan beyond that. Sorry, but that is a bad way to start play, and even very proactive players can only salvage that so much.</blockquote>

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