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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Raven Crowking" data-source="post: 5610389" data-attributes="member: 18280">Sorry, but it is a rational position to say that A can exist, but B can mitigate.  That is not at all the same thing as saying a thing is both A and not-A.I agree that you can get a character death with one failed saving throw.  I do not agree that getting to that point -- in any game I would consider a reasonable game -- occurs without context or choices that place the character in the position requiring that saving throw.  "You wake in the inn up next to a bodak" is not a game I am interested in!  <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/laugh.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing    :lol:" data-shortname=":lol:" />Actually, I recently ran this, and I can guarantee you that there are people who can and do get through the ToH without any character loss whatsoever.  I've run it in the past without character loss as well.  As a player, I did less well, but that was my fault.  Character loss is the norm, perhaps, and it is certainly easy enough to get a TPK if you are foolish.  Luck doesn't come into it much until the final encounter, because ToH is filled with ways to die which offer no save at all.  Your "saving throw" is your ability to make decisions and think quickly.  And people do run characters who survive.You are right though.....this is going in circles.  I've been playing these games for 30 years, but apparently I am deluded in my extremely consistent observation that letting the hammer fall means players start planning ahead so that the hammer need be let fall far less often.Your game is what it is.  Others' games are different.[MENTION=6679036]Dunnagin[/MENTION]:  Welcome to EN World.  I summed up why I play as I do here:  <a href="http://ravencrowking.blogspot.com/2011_05_01_archive.html" target="_blank">http://ravencrowking.blogspot.com/2011_05_01_archive.html</a>RC</blockquote>

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