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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MerricB" data-source="post: 5726608" data-attributes="member: 3586">Incidentally, in my 30th level campaign, we had a Knight character (essentials fighter defender) with a +6 throwing hammer of distance. It was pretty interesting to see: pretty much the same attack bonus and damage as his regular melee attack, 20 range(!!), no long-range penalty. The drawbacks... no power strike, and no extra critical damage (although that didn't turn up often).(Compare +36 vs AC, 2d10+21 to +36 vs AC, 2d6+21).There are two fundamental problems with the 4E design which make fighter-archers hard to achieve.The first comes from ability scores. In Basic D&D, you get a +3 difference in capability between an average fighter (10 Dex) and a great fighter (18 Dex) in their ranged capability - and thus between the ranged and melee capability as well. In AD&D, it might become +4. In 4E, the difference is between +9 and +1 for fighters without Dex as their secondary stat. It's just too much for even a basic ranged attack.The second problem is a legacy way of approaching it (which actually underpins a lot of problems with 3e). Why can't the fighter have ranged Str attacks with bows? Other classes don't have a problem with ranged weapon attacks that don't use Dex... and it's because of the legacy issues surrounding the fighter and how Str and Dex work (and because Martial characters have more problems using non-physical stats).I don't really have a problem with the fighter being a melee character without ranged powers; I just don't like how he sucks so horribly with a bow, which is far more due to how the ability scores diverge so much at higher levels.Related to this: I really dislike how many older melee characters were still using Str for their basic melee attacks, whilst their at-will attacks were something else. Huh? How does that work? One of the best additions to the Ardent class was the addition of a power - Intent Laid Bare - that can be used as a basic attack unaugmented. Suddenly, you get a character that you worry about provoking opportunity attacks around.There's a lot of early 4E design that displays how new the system was...Cheers!</blockquote>

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