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<blockquote data-quote="tetrasodium" data-source="post: 9526886" data-attributes="member: 93670">I sympathize/empathize with both of those statements but too often each of them are used as either a <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-DSAhkBJ68" target="_blank">trap card★</a> equivalent in systems lacking solid social resolution mechanics like fate draw steel☆ have.&nbsp;&nbsp; by meeting the NPC with whichever the GM wasn't using to either pen the NPC in verbal back &amp; forth or shut it down with a wall of diplomacy.&nbsp; IMO it really works best&nbsp; when the GM &amp; players use a mix of the two&nbsp; under the GM's discretion in systems like d&amp;d with less robust&nbsp; social interaction frameworks. Sure it should matter when a player who takes a social skill and &quot;invested&quot; in charisma by having a class that uses it as the primary attribute, but that doesn't mean the GM needs to allow &quot;these aren't the droids you are looking for&quot; style mind control diplomancy or zero effort &quot;I roll persuade&quot;☆ I know there are others &amp; suspect someone is ready to say &quot;but what about X system, it has them too&quot;.&nbsp; Those just aren't systems I consider myself well enough versed in to discuss so I'm not even mentioning my suspects here.★ Back in the 90s(early 2000's?) there was a pretty bad cartoon based on a TCG where practically every episode or two would have someone say &quot;you've triggered my trap card&quot; &amp; go from a bad situation to (almost always) immediate victory</blockquote>

[QUOTE="tetrasodium, post: 9526886, member: 93670"] I sympathize/empathize with both of those statements but too often each of them are used as either a [URL='https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-DSAhkBJ68']trap card★[/URL] equivalent in systems lacking solid social resolution mechanics like fate draw steel☆ have. by meeting the NPC with whichever the GM wasn't using to either pen the NPC in verbal back & forth or shut it down with a wall of diplomacy. IMO it really works best when the GM & players use a mix of the two under the GM's discretion in systems like d&d with less robust social interaction frameworks. Sure it should matter when a player who takes a social skill and "invested" in charisma by having a class that uses it as the primary attribute, but that doesn't mean the GM needs to allow "these aren't the droids you are looking for" style mind control diplomancy or zero effort "I roll persuade" ☆ I know there are others & suspect someone is ready to say "but what about X system, it has them too". Those just aren't systems I consider myself well enough versed in to discuss so I'm not even mentioning my suspects here. ★ Back in the 90s(early 2000's?) there was a pretty bad cartoon based on a TCG where practically every episode or two would have someone say "you've triggered my trap card" & go from a bad situation to [I](almost always)[/I] immediate victory [/QUOTE]

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