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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 9177666" data-attributes="member: 6801228">So you are an absolute authority on the exact levels of morality that exist? You have the answers to perfect morality? Congratulations on your prizes for solving one of the longest running sections of philosophy. You have made a value judgement that mind control is less evil that killing people. Earlier in this thread I was discussing with Mirrorrorrim who took a position that someone using just words, with no extra power, to try and influence them was evil. I bet that they may disagree with your conclusion. Personally.. I don't see "But which of these is MORE evil" as being a particularly relevant topic of conversation.  We find torture more evil than cleanly murdering someone (the idea of "humane" comes to mind). By stealing in that scenario the perpetrator has begun a process that led to the extended, potentially years long, torture and torment of an individual, potentially leading to their deaths. Is a six second death truly less horrific than a death that is extended over years, with immense suffering and shame? And, the fact that you think the law is at all relevant here... you know the law is not a measure of morality, right? Like... it is completely irrelevant what the LAW states on the issue.I think you are confusing an ethical dilemma here. I've never really heard of ethical problems, generally it is "is this ethical" and the asnwer is fairly yes or no. We don't have people who sit around and try to decide if breaking someone's fingers is ethical  because they could have murdered their loved ones instead.Wut? Firstly, no I didn't. Secondly how is this impassioned part right here "You'd be pretty evil to not see the difference between momentarily controlling them to leave than to burn them all alive." saying they are equal? You are literally calling me evil for saying they are equal. And I still don't get why, because... both are bad. I've said that. I don't see why you need to prove one is worse than the other.That most enchantment spells are used on non-combatant NPCs and not the violent enemies that you are generally committing violence against? I both finished that thought and made that point. Not sure which part you didn't see."You'd be pretty evil to not see the difference between momentarily controlling them to leave than to burn them all alive.""I said they rank equally evil. You're the one who seems to rank mind control as more evil than murder.""Making a person danced naked in the street briefly is clearly not as bad as poisoning a room full of people to death."Pick a lane, please, the whiplash is incredible. And, I think you seriously don't get the sheer unadulterated horror and pure evil that comes from forcing someone to expose themselves in public, against their will. You may need to revisit the concept of "A Fate Worse than Death" Just as an example, I've recently been reading/watching a story where the protagonists discover that an evil ruler forced his population to eat magical fruits. These fruits made it impossible to express anything other than laughter. They laugh because they are starving, because they are angry, because they are sad. Quite literally we witness a bawling child, laughing at the extended execution of her father, because she is now incapable of doing anything else. She is incapable of grieving him, and can only laugh at his death. There is a horror here, in losing your will, in losing your ability to make a choice, that I think you truly do not grasp.</blockquote>

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