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Please define 'swingy'
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<blockquote data-quote="Fanaelialae" data-source="post: 5061005" data-attributes="member: 53980"><p>I think, all other things being equal, swingy must at least have the potential to be shorter. Save or die is a perfect example of a swingy mechanic. </p><p></p><p>Assume that you have two almost identical games, except that one has SoD and the other doesn't. Also assume that it takes 4 rounds to kill someone using damage in both games. Assuming that SoD is available as a resource, the SoD game must have at least some shorter combats, because it has a mechanic for killing an enemy in 1 round rather than 4. Even if the odds of avoiding the SoD are only 25% (and therefore the average rounds of both systems are the same), the swingier game will have shorter combats now and again because the SoD user will have a string of good fortune and his adversaries will all fail their saves.</p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p>I have to disagree here. Giving the heroes a heartier buffer is an anti-swing element. A level 1 wizard in 3e might have 4 hp and be taken down by a single attack from a goblin. The same wizard in 4e might have over 20 hp and will certainly not fall to a single attack from a goblin (not even from a crit). The difference in damage between the two goblins isn't exactly huge, with the 4e gob actually dealing more. 3e is clearly the swingier system in this example.</p><p></p><p>Keep in mind that I think using the term grindy when describing 4e is a bit of a misnomer. 4e is less swingy than 3e to be certain, but there's still a fair bit of swing (a lucky string of crits will almost certainly swing combat in the party's favor). Hence, I think the term "less swingy" (when compared to previous editions) is a better fit.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Fanaelialae, post: 5061005, member: 53980"] I think, all other things being equal, swingy must at least have the potential to be shorter. Save or die is a perfect example of a swingy mechanic. Assume that you have two almost identical games, except that one has SoD and the other doesn't. Also assume that it takes 4 rounds to kill someone using damage in both games. Assuming that SoD is available as a resource, the SoD game must have at least some shorter combats, because it has a mechanic for killing an enemy in 1 round rather than 4. Even if the odds of avoiding the SoD are only 25% (and therefore the average rounds of both systems are the same), the swingier game will have shorter combats now and again because the SoD user will have a string of good fortune and his adversaries will all fail their saves. I have to disagree here. Giving the heroes a heartier buffer is an anti-swing element. A level 1 wizard in 3e might have 4 hp and be taken down by a single attack from a goblin. The same wizard in 4e might have over 20 hp and will certainly not fall to a single attack from a goblin (not even from a crit). The difference in damage between the two goblins isn't exactly huge, with the 4e gob actually dealing more. 3e is clearly the swingier system in this example. Keep in mind that I think using the term grindy when describing 4e is a bit of a misnomer. 4e is less swingy than 3e to be certain, but there's still a fair bit of swing (a lucky string of crits will almost certainly swing combat in the party's favor). Hence, I think the term "less swingy" (when compared to previous editions) is a better fit. [/QUOTE]
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