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<blockquote data-quote="incognito" data-source="post: 520002" data-attributes="member: 7008">Elder-B,I would not consider any of those characters tweaked horribly.I should mention that Paladin;s end up being a prestige class IMC, but they would not have to be for every campaign.&nbsp; Characters use thier skills quite a bit, and an 8 INT Paladin does not have much to work with.The fighter with the 8 wisdom won't make it past the first Hold Person, not to mention Sport/Listen checks...so no, no problem there.In the game I run you cannot just take a prestige class that you qualify for, it must be approved by the DM, and worked carefully into the story.I think the wizard is fairly reasonbly designed: str 10, dex 16, con 16, int 18, wis 10, cha 10, sounds about right, although again, I caution against taking a 10 wisdom.And mutli-class wise: I have no problem with it, and if I did, it wold be because a CLASS has problems:maybe&nbsp; too front loaded (like the ranger), or penalized to heavily, like the bard, for multi-classing).Seems like a main issue is, I guess, if you allow in, totally unfiltered, all the official supplements, without considering unbalancing effects they may have in the game, then yes, you do have a problem - then again, look at how many cheesy weapons, feats, and broken spell have come out of these splat-books.but I'd wager with a 28-30 weighted point buy, I can mutli-class out some horrible prestige class disaster, with optimized skills, feats leveled abilites to be just as munchy as an unweighted buy.To answer your question Elder: YES!&nbsp; the DM must ABSOLUTELY be involved with character creation. Not to do so, even with a point buy, leads to every PC to do stuff like beginning play with a wand of cure light wounds (750 gp), if they start at L3 or above.&nbsp; There are endless ways to be muchy if you say: bring in anything</blockquote>

[QUOTE="incognito, post: 520002, member: 7008"] Elder-B, I would not consider any of those characters tweaked horribly. I should mention that Paladin;s end up being a prestige class IMC, but they would not have to be for every campaign. Characters use thier skills quite a bit, and an 8 INT Paladin does not have much to work with. The fighter with the 8 wisdom won't make it past the first Hold Person, not to mention Sport/Listen checks...so no, no problem there. In the game I run you cannot just take a prestige class that you qualify for, it must be approved by the DM, and worked carefully into the story. I think the wizard is fairly reasonbly designed: str 10, dex 16, con 16, int 18, wis 10, cha 10, sounds about right, although again, I caution against taking a 10 wisdom. And mutli-class wise: I have no problem with it, and if I did, it wold be because a CLASS has problems:maybe too front loaded (like the ranger), or penalized to heavily, like the bard, for multi-classing). Seems like a main issue is, I guess, if you allow in, totally unfiltered, all the official supplements, without considering unbalancing effects they may have in the game, then yes, you do have a problem - then again, look at how many cheesy weapons, feats, and broken spell have come out of these splat-books. but I'd wager with a 28-30 weighted point buy, I can mutli-class out some horrible prestige class disaster, with optimized skills, feats leveled abilites to be just as munchy as an unweighted buy. To answer your question Elder: YES! the DM must ABSOLUTELY be involved with character creation. Not to do so, even with a point buy, leads to every PC to do stuff like beginning play with a wand of cure light wounds (750 gp), if they start at L3 or above. There are endless ways to be muchy if you say: bring in [i][b]anything[/b][/i] [/QUOTE]

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