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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Obryn" data-source="post: 6036093" data-attributes="member: 11821">So one is doing on average d8 damage and the other is doing d6 damage.  If they have their favorite weapons with them.  And absent actually wearing armor - which would indeed help, as equipment often does! - we end up with good turnip farmers trouncing trained mercenaries and guards in bar brawls.Let's bring in Experts, though, instead, who get better proficiencies and attack skills.  Capable architects, musicians, and silversmiths can now trounce equally-experienced physical laborers and farmers in a brawl.Ability scores can let you kludge an already nonsensical system, true.  But at that point, why not just rely on ability scores as would be sensible rather than trying to cram the world into a class/level system?What is gained through a full 20-level class progression that isn't gained through (1) just using something akin to 0-level rules, and (2) assigning them whatever skill bonus makes sense given their profession?Consistency is achieved through consistency.  You can mistake it for versimilitude if you squint.-O</blockquote>