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Message: <blockquote data-quote="jshaft37" data-source="post: 5823108" data-attributes="member: 6671287">Slightly off topic (I agree with the OP for the most part), but here are my thoughts based on some of the comments in this thread.I am of the opinion that creatures (PCs, NPCs, Monsters) of any level should be able to defeat a high level creature, with enough resources.  Whether those resources are terrain advantage, numbers, magical items, whatever.This is the basis of my thought: How many kobolds does it take to defeat a level 20 dragon? 50, 100, 500, 1000, 2000, 5000, infinity?  Surely, there's a number that makes sense. Lets look at the 4e Monster Vault, a level 1 Kobold Quickblade has d20+6 to its attack dealing 1d6+3 damage.A level 20 Elder Blue Dragon's AC is 34 and hp is 756, so the Kobold needs a Crit to hit the dragon.  So basically 5% of the hits will connect.  With max damage (9), it takes 84 hits to slay the dragon.  So that would equate to 1 round of 1680 Kobolds attacking the dragon at once (84hit/5% chance to hit).  If we look at average damage (6.5) you would need 117 hits, or 1 round of 2340 Kobolds to slay the dragon.Maybe those are the correct numbers? After all its just an estimation of what seems reasonable and fun in a fantasy setting.  Maybe 500 Kobolds should be able to take down a Blue Dragon in 1 round, and therefore the math should be adjusted accordingly.  My point being is that "balance" is just an iterative process, and based on 4e design, I feel that Wizards of the Coast is pretty good at running stats and crunching numbers.What should actually be discussed is the concepts behind the numbers.  Can 500 Kobolds take down the Elder Blue Dragon?  How many sword strikes from a level 5, 10, 20, 30th level fighter(s) should it take to slay that same level 20 elder blue dragon?  How does a level 15 fighter fight a room of 50 goblins?  How does a wizard fight a room of 50 goblins?  Should they be equally successful?If we can discuss those types scenarios, I feel confident that WoTC can take that information, analyze it, and produce sufficient crunch that represents the qualitative information from the players.</blockquote>

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