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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FireLance" data-source="post: 3698097" data-attributes="member: 3424">First off, general thoughts on powergaming:It isn't a binary, yes or no, on or off, black or white label. Rather, different DMs, players, and groups will have different ideas of what is an acceptable character, and what can or can not be done to achieve that character. Some don't like characters that are too powerful, or too powerful in comparison to the rest of the party. Some don't like characters with too many classes and prestige classes, or with specific classes or prestige classes, or specific combinations of classes and prestige classes. Some don't like characters (or players that want to play characters) that are well-defined mechanically, but are either generic or ill-defined in terms of personality and motivation. However, when the term "powergamer" is loosely used for any or all of the above behavior, it loses its meaning and simply becomes a generic term for "playstyle that I don't like". Now, if you are willing to define the specific powergaming behaviors that you don't like, and communicate this to the other players, it may be possible to come to some mutually satisfactory solution. Alternatively, you could just write them off as "powergamers" and never have anything to do with them again. Ever.And now, the Edition Wars section:It is a fact that 3e gives players far more opportunity to make character choices during character advancement than previous editions of the game, where the most significant choices were usually made during character creation (notably, race and class). The consequence of more choice is the potential for greater disparity between those who have made mostly poor or merely average choices, and those who have made mostly good choices.Of course, the actual disparity between choices (how much better Choice A is compared to Choice B or Choice C) is a matter of the rules, not player ability. Here, there can be a tension between restricting the scope for powergaming by making each choice as close to equal as possible, and rewarding "system mastery" or making good choices on the part of the player. I believe the current design philosophy has shifted to the former from the latter, which was more prevalent during the early days of 3e.Finally, on a personal note:I probably have a higher tolerance for powergaming than most people. My group tends to focus more on the mechanical aspects of their characters, and I'm quite free with respect to multiclassing, access to new races, classes, feats, spells, etc. and equipment selection (basically, whenever a character gains a level, he can select whatever equipment and magic items he wants, up to the standard wealth guidelines for a PC of his new level).That said, I also ensure that the challenges I have in my games can be overcome by characters that are not powergamed to the hilt. Nothing encourages players to powergame more than a continuous stream of tough challenges that push their characters' abilities to the limit. Once the players realize that their characters do not need to be fully optimized to succeed, some will spend less time trying to eke out another minor mechanical bonus, and start spending more time on the other aspects of their characters.</blockquote>

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