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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
[Practical Tactical] Provoking Opportunity Attacks for more Damage;Use that Defender!
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<blockquote data-quote="inati" data-source="post: 4485611" data-attributes="member: 71567"><p>Just for clarification, this article does not advocate making a movement of One. Please note that the initial diagram clearly states "PC continues their Move action." The article distills the movement down to the instance that a player triggers an OA, which happens to be when the player leaves a threatening square. Showing all possible movement paths after that is not within the scope of the article.</p><p></p><p>The case for "Monster Intelligence" and how it relates to tactical fighting and movement should best be left for another thread, as this issue is ultimately up to the DM and how he wishes his Monsters to fight on his table. Arguing over it here will never generate any sort of consensus; there is no "right" answer.</p><p></p><p>First of all, thank you for communicating your concerns, because I was also having similar thoughts when I began writing up the initial article (and critiquing it for myself), so it's nice to have the opportunity to address them. I would like to point out that your scenarios are flawed in that:</p><p></p><p>1. Please read Section IV 'Maintaining Flank (aka Move without Moving)' before your Monsters start thanking players for moving. (already addressed)</p><p></p><p>2. The fact that your Monster took the OA anyways, and consequently the Defender damage, shows that you have already fallen for the tactic. Usually monsters never trigger the Defender damage ability, which is kind of one of the points of the article. (already addressed)</p><p></p><p>3. This tactic also works perfectly fine even without being in flanking positions, as has been stated already in the article more than once. (already addressed)</p><p></p><p>4. If your Monster uses a shift and then a Standard action to Move away, the players have just taken away one Standard action that could have been used to attack them instead, creating a net "win" for the round. This was addressed in an earlier draft of the article under Section III titled 'Conservation of Actions', but was taken out for the final draft that was posted here due to it being overly wordy, and the fact that it didn't really have anything to do with drawing OAs. (unrelated)</p><p></p><p>5. As for the being safe from the Combat Challenge bit, that's a very good point. I've already written an article addressing this concern. However, I need to finish up the diagrams before appending it to this article. I should be done sometime this week hopefully. (to be added, pending diagrams)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="inati, post: 4485611, member: 71567"] Just for clarification, this article does not advocate making a movement of One. Please note that the initial diagram clearly states "PC continues their Move action." The article distills the movement down to the instance that a player triggers an OA, which happens to be when the player leaves a threatening square. Showing all possible movement paths after that is not within the scope of the article. The case for "Monster Intelligence" and how it relates to tactical fighting and movement should best be left for another thread, as this issue is ultimately up to the DM and how he wishes his Monsters to fight on his table. Arguing over it here will never generate any sort of consensus; there is no "right" answer. First of all, thank you for communicating your concerns, because I was also having similar thoughts when I began writing up the initial article (and critiquing it for myself), so it's nice to have the opportunity to address them. I would like to point out that your scenarios are flawed in that: 1. Please read Section IV 'Maintaining Flank (aka Move without Moving)' before your Monsters start thanking players for moving. (already addressed) 2. The fact that your Monster took the OA anyways, and consequently the Defender damage, shows that you have already fallen for the tactic. Usually monsters never trigger the Defender damage ability, which is kind of one of the points of the article. (already addressed) 3. This tactic also works perfectly fine even without being in flanking positions, as has been stated already in the article more than once. (already addressed) 4. If your Monster uses a shift and then a Standard action to Move away, the players have just taken away one Standard action that could have been used to attack them instead, creating a net "win" for the round. This was addressed in an earlier draft of the article under Section III titled 'Conservation of Actions', but was taken out for the final draft that was posted here due to it being overly wordy, and the fact that it didn't really have anything to do with drawing OAs. (unrelated) 5. As for the being safe from the Combat Challenge bit, that's a very good point. I've already written an article addressing this concern. However, I need to finish up the diagrams before appending it to this article. I should be done sometime this week hopefully. (to be added, pending diagrams) [/QUOTE]
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[Practical Tactical] Provoking Opportunity Attacks for more Damage;Use that Defender!
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