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Pre-American industrial "evolution"
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<blockquote data-quote="fusangite" data-source="post: 1903826" data-attributes="member: 7240"><p>Because the highest death rate over a century in Europe was still only about 50% (1300-1400). In the Mexico Valley, the death rate was over 80% from 1520-1620. That's a very substantial difference. Secondly, Europe was lucky in that none of their immediate neighbours were much better off than they were. If the Ottoman Turks had had a drastically different level of immunity then, yes, they would have swept into Europe a lot further. What mattered in the Americas was one population having a 10% death rate and the other having an 80% death rate; if the difference is less, the microbes confer less of an advantage.</p><p></p><p>Another important factor was the Europe's immediate neighbours were busy fighting the Mongols who were principally to blame for the epidemic's spread. Of course, if the Mongols, as they originally intended under Batu Khan, had actually tried to invade Western Europe, they would have succeeded. But 100 years after Batu Khan's death, that dream was basically lost as the various successor khanates focused in on keeping what land they had and fighting amongst themselves.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Because sub-saharan Africans domesticated fowl, cows and pigs, conferring upon them largely the same immunities Europeans had.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It did. In order to have immunity to diseases through exposure, constant exposure to ever-mutating germs is exactly what is necessary. As I mentioned previously, the Mexico Valley was exceptional in that nearly all food came from vegetable matter thanks to the high fat content of avocadoes. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Everyone has been recommending <em>Guns, Germs and Steel</em> which I have not read. Unfortunately, the books I have read have been very focused on demographics and culture so I can't help you out any more than other posters to the thread have. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Actually I was referring to <em>this</em> civilization we are living in now. Go through the ancient Greek written record: bookkeeping was absolutely not the main purpose of the written record. It was hardly used for that at all. While the rare society like the Carolingians or the Incas sees the written record functioning primarily to record financial or material transactions, most tend to use the written record for more elevated purposes.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="fusangite, post: 1903826, member: 7240"] Because the highest death rate over a century in Europe was still only about 50% (1300-1400). In the Mexico Valley, the death rate was over 80% from 1520-1620. That's a very substantial difference. Secondly, Europe was lucky in that none of their immediate neighbours were much better off than they were. If the Ottoman Turks had had a drastically different level of immunity then, yes, they would have swept into Europe a lot further. What mattered in the Americas was one population having a 10% death rate and the other having an 80% death rate; if the difference is less, the microbes confer less of an advantage. Another important factor was the Europe's immediate neighbours were busy fighting the Mongols who were principally to blame for the epidemic's spread. Of course, if the Mongols, as they originally intended under Batu Khan, had actually tried to invade Western Europe, they would have succeeded. But 100 years after Batu Khan's death, that dream was basically lost as the various successor khanates focused in on keeping what land they had and fighting amongst themselves. Because sub-saharan Africans domesticated fowl, cows and pigs, conferring upon them largely the same immunities Europeans had. It did. In order to have immunity to diseases through exposure, constant exposure to ever-mutating germs is exactly what is necessary. As I mentioned previously, the Mexico Valley was exceptional in that nearly all food came from vegetable matter thanks to the high fat content of avocadoes. Everyone has been recommending [i]Guns, Germs and Steel[/i] which I have not read. Unfortunately, the books I have read have been very focused on demographics and culture so I can't help you out any more than other posters to the thread have. Actually I was referring to [i]this[/i] civilization we are living in now. Go through the ancient Greek written record: bookkeeping was absolutely not the main purpose of the written record. It was hardly used for that at all. While the rare society like the Carolingians or the Incas sees the written record functioning primarily to record financial or material transactions, most tend to use the written record for more elevated purposes. [/QUOTE]
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