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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Presentation vs design... vs philosophy
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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 7933586" data-attributes="member: 87792"><p>One of my friends has DM'd enough that she has. But this is somewhere I fundamentally disagree with oD&D at a philosophical level. The player knowing their defence values just makes things running a whole lot smoother and feel more fair.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It was 4e - no actual dice rolling. So not an issue. (No dice rolling at 1st level in 3.X or 5e normally IME - but hit point rolling at other levels.)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It may be a personal thing, but I find tablets a lot friendlier than laptops as a reference tool - they don't create a DM screen style barrier. On the other hand if taking extensive notes it's a laptop every time.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And that I find just <em>weird. </em>I like to know what my character can do, and absolutely hate stalling the game out to look something up in the rulebook.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Great Cleave I agree is an upgraded version of Cleave, which is slightly different to my objection to prerequisites here. It's Power Attack -> Cleave I'm objecting to. Upgrades are different.</p><p></p><p>That said I very much disagree that Great Cleave is too powerful. Cleave is something that regularly triggers and is therefore one of the best melee feats in the game. Triggering the extra attacks from Great Cleave (beyond the Cleave one) is much harder and in practice it's a pretty weak feat.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The first time I forgot it I'd have kicked myself. The second time I forgot it I would have rewritten my character sheet so that there was no third time. But of course I'm used to control of my character sheet - it's <em>my </em>tool, not the DM's. And if it's leading me astray it should be re-written.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Why not both? I'd have the most common use <em>and </em>the default case on the sheet.</p><p></p><p>Depends on the player. Someone reqriting my character sheet would probably get yelled at, as now nothing would be where I'd put it and thus expect to find it. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm not surprised. But when I'm summoning monsters I need their statblocks handy. And when one of my feats <a href="https://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/augment-summoning/" target="_blank">actually changes their statblock</a> I'm going to want my own version so there's no calculating on the fly - instead I calculated it between sessions. The 33 pages by the way doesn't count the size of the monsters I'd levelled out of summoning and so deleted off the sheet. And when I complain about crunch that sort of thing is what I mean.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 7933586, member: 87792"] One of my friends has DM'd enough that she has. But this is somewhere I fundamentally disagree with oD&D at a philosophical level. The player knowing their defence values just makes things running a whole lot smoother and feel more fair. It was 4e - no actual dice rolling. So not an issue. (No dice rolling at 1st level in 3.X or 5e normally IME - but hit point rolling at other levels.) It may be a personal thing, but I find tablets a lot friendlier than laptops as a reference tool - they don't create a DM screen style barrier. On the other hand if taking extensive notes it's a laptop every time. And that I find just [I]weird. [/I]I like to know what my character can do, and absolutely hate stalling the game out to look something up in the rulebook. Great Cleave I agree is an upgraded version of Cleave, which is slightly different to my objection to prerequisites here. It's Power Attack -> Cleave I'm objecting to. Upgrades are different. That said I very much disagree that Great Cleave is too powerful. Cleave is something that regularly triggers and is therefore one of the best melee feats in the game. Triggering the extra attacks from Great Cleave (beyond the Cleave one) is much harder and in practice it's a pretty weak feat. The first time I forgot it I'd have kicked myself. The second time I forgot it I would have rewritten my character sheet so that there was no third time. But of course I'm used to control of my character sheet - it's [I]my [/I]tool, not the DM's. And if it's leading me astray it should be re-written. Why not both? I'd have the most common use [I]and [/I]the default case on the sheet. Depends on the player. Someone reqriting my character sheet would probably get yelled at, as now nothing would be where I'd put it and thus expect to find it. :) I'm not surprised. But when I'm summoning monsters I need their statblocks handy. And when one of my feats [URL='https://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/augment-summoning/']actually changes their statblock[/URL] I'm going to want my own version so there's no calculating on the fly - instead I calculated it between sessions. The 33 pages by the way doesn't count the size of the monsters I'd levelled out of summoning and so deleted off the sheet. And when I complain about crunch that sort of thing is what I mean. [/QUOTE]
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