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<blockquote data-quote="Spatula" data-source="post: 1431740" data-attributes="member: 2198">That's actually wrong, a lethal attack has to exceed the Massive Damage Threshold in order to trigger the saving throw.&nbsp; A character with a 12 Con needs to take 13 damage before saving for massive damage.&nbsp; And then the character has a 35% + 5-30% chance of making the save (due to action points).Earlier you brought up Mad Max.&nbsp; I don't think Mad Max would have had a 12 Con, more like 16, which would make him basically immune to an AK-47 in the hands of a commoner.&nbsp; Even if said commoner rolled a 20, a threat, he wouldn't be able to confirm the crit in all likelihood (natural 20 on a confirm roll is not an automatic hit, and Max would have a fairly high Defense).I've been playing non-FX Modern for a while now, and I don't think gun combat is lethal once you hit 4th-5th level (EDIT: and not really particularly lethal past 1st level).&nbsp; The possibility of getting knocked out is always there, but it's not very likely and you have the rest of the group to keep you from dying.&nbsp; Crits are extremely rare, even with a two-gun wielding Gunslinger in the group.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Spatula, post: 1431740, member: 2198"] That's actually wrong, a lethal attack has to [b]exceed[/b] the Massive Damage Threshold in order to trigger the saving throw. A character with a 12 Con needs to take 13 damage before saving for massive damage. And then the character has a 35% + 5-30% chance of making the save (due to action points). Earlier you brought up Mad Max. I don't think Mad Max would have had a 12 Con, more like 16, which would make him basically immune to an AK-47 in the hands of a commoner. Even if said commoner rolled a 20, a threat, he wouldn't be able to confirm the crit in all likelihood (natural 20 on a confirm roll is not an automatic hit, and Max would have a fairly high Defense). I've been playing non-FX Modern for a while now, and I don't think gun combat is lethal once you hit 4th-5th level (EDIT: and not really particularly lethal past 1st level). The possibility of getting knocked out is always there, but it's not very likely and you have the rest of the group to keep you from dying. Crits are extremely rare, even with a two-gun wielding Gunslinger in the group. [/QUOTE]

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