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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neorealist" data-source="post: 3111919" data-attributes="member: 43571">Not exactly, for you see, every orb spell is listed with a range at which you can place the spell effect. Looking in my spell compendium i find the range (at least for orb of acid) is close (25ft+5ft per 2 Cl's). and so by my ruling above, you can effect anything that is in close range when you cast the spell. In addition, the orb spell which i'm looking at right now says the spell shoots from your palm, and that you must succeed ranged touch attack with it to hit your target. So the "shooting from your palm when cast" is part of the successful casting of the spell. What has you confused is the instantanious duration. think of it this way: the magic that created that orb of force or acid or whatever is instantanious, but the orb is still there and in flight after the magic is finished creating it. (so you end up with something really silly like a magically created permanent construct thats only purpose is to explode on contact with your target, with no rules as to what happens if you miss)<tongue in cheek> Lets create a spell, we'll call it 'Evokers Wet Dream'. we'll base it off of fireball, but since we want it to be different we'll only have it effect one target. To compensate for that, lets up the damage cap on it to 15d6 rather than 10d6. As well, we don't want the monsters saving against it, so lets negate spell resistance AND not allow a saving throw, but instead substitute a range touch attack which any mage worth the name should be able to accomplish consistantly 80-95% of the time. (got to allow for those ones. and monks; we hates the monkssess <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />)Finally, just for kicks lets make it in every damage type possible, and add nifty additional effects to those types to make them even more 'unique' (they can save for those right? that makes them balanced?). Sounds like a good spell? well sorry suc... err blaster mages, but this is just too 'cool' to be anything but a conjuration spell. </tongue in cheek>Produce flame on the other hand states "Flames as bright as a torch appear in your open hand." thats it; no shooting from the palm, or flies at the target you designate, or any other verbiage indicating the flames appear or go anywhere other than "your open hand"The spell then goes on to tell you that you can now make either melee touch attacks or ranged touch attacks to inflict fire on something, and how those touch attacks should be arbitrated. It doesn't say you can freely ignore the normal rules for making a "melee touch attack" or a "ranged touch attack" when you do so, nor does it give you an additional standard action in which to complete either of the above types of action when you cast the spell.To sum: orb spells: range close, touch attack required to resolve hit when cast.produce flame: range 0, touch attacks required to throw flames.</blockquote>

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