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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Beholder Bob" data-source="post: 1645817" data-attributes="member: 12866">In a nice way - this is insane!!!  To be a professional tumbler I need:Tumble (the skill)tumble (the perform skill)acrobatics (the profession)To be good, I need, what, 5 ranks in each?  15 skill points to be a tumbler!In my game, I have removed profession and craft and replaced it with vocation.  It functions as both, as they apply to the task at hand.Vocation cook: you can make a living at it (like a professional), and you can try to make elaborate dishes for the king (as a craft).Vocation weapon/armor smith: I run a shop (like a professional), and make armor & weapons (craft)Vocation sailor: I earn a decent wage (like a professional), and keep the ship 'ship-shape' with repairs and replacements (craft).Skill points are far and few between, and most seem to feel profession is only taken for a rank or two for flavor.  This seems silly - a sacrifice of a few skill points to show others your character has 'depth'?  Please!Perform is its own profession/craft - you should not need to buy a skill twice.  Perform harp does not require a separate vocation (or profession) in harp.As to the rolls:When a vocation is used to interact with fellows in the same field, I allow it to substitute for diplomacy (a glazier speaking with another glazier can 'talk shop') so long as the subject of the diplomacy remains relevant to the profession.  The skill uses charisma for this check.When the vocation is used to evaluate the value of an item produced by the vocation (a gemcutter evaluation a gem), the vocation can substitute for appraise.  The skill uses intelligence for this check.When trying to make a day to day living, use wisdom.When making a product, use intelligence.5+ ranks in diplomacy gives a synergy bonus with a social check, 5+ ranks in appraise gives synergy for appraisal in your specialty (a 6 rank appraisal, 6 rank vocation gem-cutter knows his gems!)Vocation basket weaving 4 ranks___________________social 5___________________living  6_________________appraise 8_____________create/repair 8B<img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/devious.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":]" title="Devious    :]" data-shortname=":]" />B</blockquote>

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