Project Image

[JacktheRabbit]

Had a problem with this spell today. DM (based on previous rulings as a player) decided that Will Saves for Project Image only happen if you chose to disbelieve.

This makes no sense to me since the spell takes damage and lets you cast through it. To everyone else we figured that any time you inflict damage in any way except from area effect spells you get to make a disbelieve Will Save.

Players are right and DM was going by a false ruling from a previous DM right?

As a side item. The first act by the party was to encase the Projected Image in a Wall of Force. This should have instantly broken Line of Effect and ended the spell with no saves needed anyway right?

 

[Dandu]

Will saves are generally automatic if you interact with the image. Shooting an arrow at it (for example) does count as interaction, I believe.

The image should still work if you cut off LoE by my reading.

 

[JacktheRabbit]

From my reading the spell instantly ends when Line of Effect is blocked. Here is the last paragraph of the spell.

You must maintain line of effect to the
projected image at all times. If your line of
effect is obstructed, the spell ends. If you
use dimension door, teleport, plane shift, or a
similar spell that breaks your line of effect,
even momentarily, the spell ends.

 

[Dandu]

Damn, I must have misremembered my spells.

Are you all set as far as clarifications go, then?

 

[irdeggman]

Had a problem with this spell today. DM (based on previous rulings as a player) decided that Will Saves for Project Image only happen if you chose to disbelieve.

This is true, but if you interact with the illusion you are given the chance to disbelieve and the DM should point that out to the players. The players always have the option to choose to believe an illusion and thus not attempt the saving throw.

 

[JacktheRabbit]

This is true, but if you interact with the illusion you are given the chance to disbelieve and the DM should point that out to the players. The players always have the option to choose to believe an illusion and thus not attempt the saving throw.

The problem here being that the DM never said anything. What player is just going to wander around aimlessly disbelieving the world.

 

[NewJeffCT]

The problem here being that the DM never said anything. What player is just going to wander around aimlessly disbelieving the world.

Just say they're from Missouri - "Show me"

 

[frankthedm]

Had a problem with this spell today. DM (based on previous rulings as a player) decided that Will Saves for Project Image only happen if you chose to disbelieve.

This makes no sense to me since the spell takes damage and lets you cast through it. To everyone else we figured that any time you inflict damage in any way except from area effect spells you get to make a disbelieve Will Save.

Players are right and DM was going by a false ruling from a previous DM right?

Sounds more like your DM was putting more stock in what he remembered from previous editions rather than what the newer books say.

Project Image :: d20srd.org
Spell Descriptions :: d20srd.org

Though recognizing a projected image just lets you know it is an illusion, the spells using the image as a PoO don't really care if you see through the caster's double.

As a side item. The first act by the party was to encase the Projected Image in a Wall of Force. This should have instantly broken Line of Effect and ended the spell with no saves needed anyway right?

Encased how? Wall of Force is a single flat vertical plane. If you DID break line of effect, yes, the spell would have ended

 

[Nebten]

The sad thing is at higher levels its pretty easy for caster to Spellcraft that it was an illusion spell, thus knowing its false. I feel bad for the Shadow caster in my group . . .