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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Kerrick" data-source="post: 5018009" data-attributes="member: 4722">For those of you just joining our program, we're discussing the Project Phoenix fighter (and other classes), which can be found <a href="http://project-phoenix.wikidot.com/classes:classes" target="_blank">here</a>I'm not going to argue that point, because you're right. I've seen many splatbook PrCs that should really have been nothing more than a few feats or a feat chain.I could create an archery style, but I felt that was more the purview of the ranger.How many different concepts are there? I covered the major (most commonly chosen) ones: two-weapon, sword and board, two-hander, and unarmed. If someone wants to create a path for their obscure one-off character, they're more than welcome, but I'm not going to break my brain trying to think up every single possible fighting style in existince.So tell me... why is it that the general consensus of the 3.5 fighter is "It's not worth taking past 4th level"?Weapon feats are the equivalent of several Weapon Focus feats at once. Tell me again why that's a bad thing?No, but again, I've added abilities for the most commonly chosen fighting styles. Instead of your tank simply taking Power Attack, Cleave, and Great Cleave just like every other tank, he can go with Oversized Weapon, Mighty Strike, and Pounding Strike, whereas his buddy Bob can take Imposing Size, Dazing Blow, and Pounding Strike. I don't see how this is bad, considering this is in addition to all those bonus feats you keep going on about (which is the third time I've said that now).Spring Attack: fighter 4, rogue 6. The fighter has a whole extra feat over the rogue at that point.Yeah. But if were building a duelist in 3.5, I'd go with 4 levels of fighter (for the Spring Attack chain and WS), then rogue, Duelist, and maybe even Weapon Master, if it were allowed. In PP, I could stick with fighter and take some stuff from Cat Style, mix it up with a few rogue levels, and get the same effect without having to take the PrC. You might argue that it's the same number of class levels, and you might be right, but it's nice for campaigns that don't allow PrCs, or for players who want to keep the number of classes to a manageable number.Hadn't thought of that, but the 3.5 fighter is weaker. My fighter is definitely stronger, however.I was trying to say that if I wanted to build a duelist, I would be stupid not to include rogue levels, given that a rogue's sneak attack is vastly superior to the piddling feats a fighter gets. I'm not going to say that a rogue vs. a fighter with the same build will be superior; at L20, the fighter will have one more attack (assuming a single weapon), +5 BAB, many more hit points, and several more feats. The rogue, OTOH, will have 8d6 sneak attack, several special abilities, improved uncanny dodge, and evasion. Sure, the fighter will wipe the floor with the rogue in a straight-up fight, but that's what he's supposed to do. He's a fighter. Fighters fight - we agreed on that point. A rogue's schtick is guerrilla warfare - striker, hit and run tactics. That's where his abilities shine: sneak attack, evasion, opportunist, etc. Put the rogue against the fighter in a shadowed maze, and I'd put even money on either of them winning.That means at least 75% of class abilities would be feats, and most classes would get nothing BUT feats. You can't be serious.Hey, we agree on something! That's what my intent was - to make the fighter (and every other class) more focused at what it does, and better at it, than anyone else. Tell me: do you think a PP fighter could best any member of any other class in one-on-one combat? If the answer is yes, then I've accomplished my goal.Exactly! But if you turn it into a feat chain, anyone can learn it and it ceases to be special.First off, there are eight abilities, not six, and second, I see four that do cool stuff: Imposing Size, Oversized Weapon, Pounding Strike, and Stunning Blow. Sure, they do stuff in addition to hitting things, but again, that's the fighter's schtick: hitting things. The Bear Style is about hitting things hard.</blockquote>

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