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<blockquote data-quote="Anubis" data-source="post: 319088" data-attributes="member: 2358">Okay, you want a better example, I'll give you one!Let's take the Level 30 NPCs from the ELH, both the Wizard and the Fighter!First, lets replace the Wizard's &quot;Brew Potion&quot; with &quot;Empower Spell&quot; and then replace the Wizard's &quot;Epic Spell Penetration&quot; with &quot;Improved Metamagic&quot; . . . This is so the Wizard has the feats to demonstrate my point.The Fighter needs no changes.Now, let's look at an average fight between these two.Initiative: Fighter +4, Wizard +8, the Wizard will, on average, go first.Round 1:Wizard casts Haste on himself and approaches within melee range of Fighter.&nbsp; Partial action, Wizard casts Vampiric Touch [Maximize, Empower x8]; on average, Wizard will get through Blink easily enough, and on average, Wizard will score a hit with a touch attack against AC 16; on average, Fighter will take 200 damage {60 (6*10, Maximize) + (3.5*10/2)*8 = 200}; Fighter is down to 75 HP, Wizard is up to 338 HP.Figher uses Boots of Speed to Haste himself.&nbsp; Partial action, Fighter attacks; on average, Fighter will easily hit AC 32; on average, Wizard will take 20 damage; Wizard is down to 318 HP.Round 2:Wizard casts Power Word, Kill (casting on the defensive); Fighter is killed instantly; Fighter dies, Wizard wins.Okay, does THIS satisfy you all?&nbsp; Empower Spell stacking is what allowed Wizard to cut Fighter down to so few HP that he killed him with Power Word, Kill.&nbsp; Of course, Fighter could have had over 500 HP to start, and the outcome would've been the same, because the Wizard could have used another Vampiric Touch, Horrid Wilting, and/or Meteor Swarm to take out Fighter in Round 2 with NO DIFFICULTY.In other words, a SQUASH, all due to Empower Spell.&nbsp; With PCs, it would have been even worse!There, a real example with reaonable factors!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Anubis, post: 319088, member: 2358"] Okay, you want a better example, I'll give you one! Let's take the Level 30 NPCs from the ELH, both the Wizard and the Fighter! First, lets replace the Wizard's "Brew Potion" with "Empower Spell" and then replace the Wizard's "Epic Spell Penetration" with "Improved Metamagic" . . . This is so the Wizard has the feats to demonstrate my point. The Fighter needs no changes. Now, let's look at an average fight between these two. Initiative: Fighter +4, Wizard +8, the Wizard will, on average, go first. Round 1: Wizard casts Haste on himself and approaches within melee range of Fighter. Partial action, Wizard casts Vampiric Touch [Maximize, Empower x8]; on average, Wizard will get through Blink easily enough, and on average, Wizard will score a hit with a touch attack against AC 16; on average, Fighter will take 200 damage {60 (6*10, Maximize) + (3.5*10/2)*8 = 200}; Fighter is down to 75 HP, Wizard is up to 338 HP. Figher uses Boots of Speed to Haste himself. Partial action, Fighter attacks; on average, Fighter will easily hit AC 32; on average, Wizard will take 20 damage; Wizard is down to 318 HP. Round 2: Wizard casts Power Word, Kill (casting on the defensive); Fighter is killed instantly; Fighter dies, Wizard wins. Okay, does THIS satisfy you all? Empower Spell stacking is what allowed Wizard to cut Fighter down to so few HP that he killed him with Power Word, Kill. Of course, Fighter could have had over 500 HP to start, and the outcome would've been the same, because the Wizard could have used another Vampiric Touch, Horrid Wilting, and/or Meteor Swarm to take out Fighter in Round 2 with NO DIFFICULTY. In other words, a SQUASH, all due to Empower Spell. With PCs, it would have been even worse! There, a real example with reaonable factors! [/QUOTE]

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