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<blockquote data-quote="fireinthedust" data-source="post: 4753198" data-attributes="member: 51930">Yeah, I've thought about the optimization levels of it somewhat.&nbsp;I think my take on it is that the physical side of things means that only warriors get the benefit of the Manifestations.&nbsp; 4e, unlike previous editions, doesn't have that massive avalanche of power creep for spellcasters above other classes the other editions had.&nbsp; The whole idea of balance, that everyone has the same power output merely with different primary stats and effect styles (strikers vs one guy, controllers vs. a bunch), really makes a big difference.&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; A difference for 4e is that we're not looking at the &quot;reasons&quot; things are the way they are.&nbsp; We're looking at what makes a fun game for the PCs.&nbsp; &nbsp;In fact, considering the Manifestations are stormSOUL and fireSOUL, it does seem that having the elemental side of things physical is not necessarily correct.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Now taking the feats doesn't rely on a stat as much as I'd thought; specifically, Airsoul and Watersoul give movement, and Stormsoul gives me that extra d8 lightning damage.&nbsp; Earth and Fire are where the attacks come in, and the Elemental Tempest paragon path powers.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I do see the counter-argument, that it would allow a character to just jump in with one stat (Int) and have all their powers come off of that; that it seems like a bid at optimization.&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; I just don't know that this sort of optimization is necessarily bad for the game, or that different from the classes that are already out there.&nbsp; A Barbarian Genasi, for example, with stormsoul and earthsoul, would be adding their primary stat (Str) to their single-target damage already.&nbsp; Swordmages don't need a high Str as it stands with Intelligent Blademaster.&nbsp;CORRECTING IT:&nbsp;&nbsp; would it be alright if this was a Wizard feat?&nbsp; Like, pre-requisite: Genasi, Wizard.&nbsp;That way a Swordmage wouldn't be able to use it AND intelligent blademaster to power their way through having only the one stat needed.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="fireinthedust, post: 4753198, member: 51930"] Yeah, I've thought about the optimization levels of it somewhat. I think my take on it is that the physical side of things means that only warriors get the benefit of the Manifestations. 4e, unlike previous editions, doesn't have that massive avalanche of power creep for spellcasters above other classes the other editions had. The whole idea of balance, that everyone has the same power output merely with different primary stats and effect styles (strikers vs one guy, controllers vs. a bunch), really makes a big difference. A difference for 4e is that we're not looking at the "reasons" things are the way they are. We're looking at what makes a fun game for the PCs. In fact, considering the Manifestations are stormSOUL and fireSOUL, it does seem that having the elemental side of things physical is not necessarily correct. Now taking the feats doesn't rely on a stat as much as I'd thought; specifically, Airsoul and Watersoul give movement, and Stormsoul gives me that extra d8 lightning damage. Earth and Fire are where the attacks come in, and the Elemental Tempest paragon path powers. I do see the counter-argument, that it would allow a character to just jump in with one stat (Int) and have all their powers come off of that; that it seems like a bid at optimization. I just don't know that this sort of optimization is necessarily bad for the game, or that different from the classes that are already out there. A Barbarian Genasi, for example, with stormsoul and earthsoul, would be adding their primary stat (Str) to their single-target damage already. Swordmages don't need a high Str as it stands with Intelligent Blademaster. CORRECTING IT: would it be alright if this was a Wizard feat? Like, pre-requisite: Genasi, Wizard. That way a Swordmage wouldn't be able to use it AND intelligent blademaster to power their way through having only the one stat needed. [/QUOTE]

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