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Proposal: Minotaur - MM, (Dragon,) PH3 - which one(s) allow for L4W
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<blockquote data-quote="Kalidrev" data-source="post: 5102677" data-attributes="member: 84005"><p>And I say that the Bugbear and the Minotaur just suck, as shown thus far, without the Oversized feature. </p><p></p><p>The Bugbear without Oversized (and nothing to replace it with) is a worse version of the Half-Orc; Let's compare:</p><p></p><p>Stats: Both have +2 Dex, +2 Str</p><p></p><p>Half-Orc Skills: +2 Endurance, +2 Intimidate; </p><p></p><p>Bugbear Skills: +2 Intimidate, +2 Stealth;</p><p></p><p>Comparison: Even Steven</p><p></p><p>Half-Orc Racial abilities: Furious Assault Encounter Power: +1[W]/+1d8 damage on any attack you hit with as a FREE action; Half-Orc resilience: 5 temp HP first time bloodied; Swift Charge: +2 speed when charging.</p><p></p><p>Bugbear Racial abilities: Oversized: use large weapons; Predatory Eye: mini sneak attack (+1d6 dmg IF you have combat advantage, and you must spend a minor action to activate it).</p><p></p><p>Comparison: The larger weapon size evens out the damage that the Bugbear is missing in comparison to what it's losing compared to the half-orc encounter power, but it's racial ability sucks compared to the half-orcs unless said half-orc is using a 1d4 weapon. Without Oversized, the Bugbear would seriously pale in comparison to the Half-Orc.</p><p></p><p>Now let's compare the Minotaurs:</p><p></p><p>Stats: Both have +2 Str, +2 Con</p><p></p><p>Skills: Both have +2 Nature, +2 Perception</p><p></p><p>Racial Abilities: </p><p></p><p>MM Mino: Ferocity (free action melee basic attack when you are reduced to 0 HP), Oversized (same as bugbear), Goring Charge: Str +2/4/6 vs AC charge attack; deals 1d6/2d6/3d6+str dmg and knocks prone.</p><p></p><p>Dragon Mino: Ferocity (same as MM Mino), Goring Charge: Str +4/6/8 vs AC charge attack that deals 1d6/2d6/3d6 +Str damage and knocks prone; Heedless Charge: +2 racial bonus to AC vs OA's during a charge.</p><p></p><p>Comparison: Both races are pretty darned similar, but I think the MM Mino still has the upper hand; Oversized gives a steady increased weapon damage increase over the Dragon Minotaur, though the Dragon Minotaur's Goring Charge is more accurate. The Heedless Charge is nice, but nothing to write home about...it's not even as good as the halflings racial bonus vs op attacks (cause it's situational). In short, I don't like how they have changed the Minotaur thus far.</p><p></p><p>I'm curious to see what the PHB3 Minotaur is going to be like, but until then, I would much rather have the MM Minotaur than the Dragon Minotaur.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kalidrev, post: 5102677, member: 84005"] And I say that the Bugbear and the Minotaur just suck, as shown thus far, without the Oversized feature. The Bugbear without Oversized (and nothing to replace it with) is a worse version of the Half-Orc; Let's compare: Stats: Both have +2 Dex, +2 Str Half-Orc Skills: +2 Endurance, +2 Intimidate; Bugbear Skills: +2 Intimidate, +2 Stealth; Comparison: Even Steven Half-Orc Racial abilities: Furious Assault Encounter Power: +1[W]/+1d8 damage on any attack you hit with as a FREE action; Half-Orc resilience: 5 temp HP first time bloodied; Swift Charge: +2 speed when charging. Bugbear Racial abilities: Oversized: use large weapons; Predatory Eye: mini sneak attack (+1d6 dmg IF you have combat advantage, and you must spend a minor action to activate it). Comparison: The larger weapon size evens out the damage that the Bugbear is missing in comparison to what it's losing compared to the half-orc encounter power, but it's racial ability sucks compared to the half-orcs unless said half-orc is using a 1d4 weapon. Without Oversized, the Bugbear would seriously pale in comparison to the Half-Orc. Now let's compare the Minotaurs: Stats: Both have +2 Str, +2 Con Skills: Both have +2 Nature, +2 Perception Racial Abilities: MM Mino: Ferocity (free action melee basic attack when you are reduced to 0 HP), Oversized (same as bugbear), Goring Charge: Str +2/4/6 vs AC charge attack; deals 1d6/2d6/3d6+str dmg and knocks prone. Dragon Mino: Ferocity (same as MM Mino), Goring Charge: Str +4/6/8 vs AC charge attack that deals 1d6/2d6/3d6 +Str damage and knocks prone; Heedless Charge: +2 racial bonus to AC vs OA's during a charge. Comparison: Both races are pretty darned similar, but I think the MM Mino still has the upper hand; Oversized gives a steady increased weapon damage increase over the Dragon Minotaur, though the Dragon Minotaur's Goring Charge is more accurate. The Heedless Charge is nice, but nothing to write home about...it's not even as good as the halflings racial bonus vs op attacks (cause it's situational). In short, I don't like how they have changed the Minotaur thus far. I'm curious to see what the PHB3 Minotaur is going to be like, but until then, I would much rather have the MM Minotaur than the Dragon Minotaur. [/QUOTE]
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Proposal: Minotaur - MM, (Dragon,) PH3 - which one(s) allow for L4W
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