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<blockquote data-quote="S'mon" data-source="post: 6127632" data-attributes="member: 463"><p>Most of my 4e campaigns don't use PHB3, I've never had any problem with players demanding to play psionic PCs. Nowhere in the 4e books does it say "Your GM must allow this stuff". Sure WoTC want me to allow it, just as Gygax wanted me to buy and use 1e Unearthed Arcana (I did, more fool me), but they don't try to force me to allow it AFAICT. I don't totally dismiss your experience BTW - I did see a player in another GM's 4e game complain that the GM was 'doing it wrong' by restricting sources, eg not allowing Eberron stuff in a non-Eberron campaign. But I don't think that is a 4e thing in particular, or the fault of 4e presentation. I've met dozens and dozens of players over the past five years, of course a few will be jerks.</p><p></p><p>Grumbling about inappropriate encounters -bad linear <strong>adventure design</strong> can cause this as a somewhat legitimate grievance: in a linear adventure the players may feel forced into the encounter that lies along the railroad line. If it then feels impossible to win, I understand why they may feel aggrieved. The best solution is to not run linear adventures. The second-best is to scale everything to the PCs. IME this is far, far more a problem in 3e and PF adventure paths because offense outstrips defence, encounter design is built on a knife edge, and what was designed as tough-but-winnable can easily become an unwinnable TPK waiting to happen.</p><p></p><p>If the GM is running a sandbox/open campaign and players still grumble about the potential existence of unbeatable fights, that would be a problem. It takes an aggressive misreading of either 3e or 4e encounter building guidelines to get to that point, though. Both allow for unwinnable encounters - 3e even says to include unwinnable encounters - so a player who has read the guidelines should be aware of their potential to exist.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="S'mon, post: 6127632, member: 463"] Most of my 4e campaigns don't use PHB3, I've never had any problem with players demanding to play psionic PCs. Nowhere in the 4e books does it say "Your GM must allow this stuff". Sure WoTC want me to allow it, just as Gygax wanted me to buy and use 1e Unearthed Arcana (I did, more fool me), but they don't try to force me to allow it AFAICT. I don't totally dismiss your experience BTW - I did see a player in another GM's 4e game complain that the GM was 'doing it wrong' by restricting sources, eg not allowing Eberron stuff in a non-Eberron campaign. But I don't think that is a 4e thing in particular, or the fault of 4e presentation. I've met dozens and dozens of players over the past five years, of course a few will be jerks. Grumbling about inappropriate encounters -bad linear [B]adventure design[/B] can cause this as a somewhat legitimate grievance: in a linear adventure the players may feel forced into the encounter that lies along the railroad line. If it then feels impossible to win, I understand why they may feel aggrieved. The best solution is to not run linear adventures. The second-best is to scale everything to the PCs. IME this is far, far more a problem in 3e and PF adventure paths because offense outstrips defence, encounter design is built on a knife edge, and what was designed as tough-but-winnable can easily become an unwinnable TPK waiting to happen. If the GM is running a sandbox/open campaign and players still grumble about the potential existence of unbeatable fights, that would be a problem. It takes an aggressive misreading of either 3e or 4e encounter building guidelines to get to that point, though. Both allow for unwinnable encounters - 3e even says to include unwinnable encounters - so a player who has read the guidelines should be aware of their potential to exist. [/QUOTE]
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