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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Gadget" data-source="post: 7416256" data-attributes="member: 23716">[MENTION=58172]Yaarel[/MENTION]I seem to have misinterpreted; not having watched the video in the link, I assumed that the proposed spell lists listed above were put forth by MM as potential ways of doing a wizard psion subclass.  I did not realize that these were your own proposals based upon the ideas in the video and made my comments accordingly. Agreed.  I suspect that the devs (and probably devs of editions past) struggled to come up with high level illusion spells worth their slot.  Phantasmal Killer and Weird (really Mass Phantasmal Killer) would be much improved if the target took the physic damage at the start of their turn, followed by the save to end at the end of their turn.  I'm still not sure Weird is worth its high level slot even with this improvement though. I can't say I disagree.  Care should be taken, and some play testing needed, but you have a point.Fireball, along with lightning bolt, is somewhat problematic, as it was purposely 'overpowered' for its level due to its iconic status in the game;  according to the guidelines in the DMG, it should be a 5th level spell.  Personally, I think they should have made these spells do 7d6 damage, still a bit supercharged for third level, but not egregiously so, and more importantly, not making most of other spells seem so severely under powered in comparison.  But that ship has sailed, and I see your point.Agreed.Old school spells in particular were more built around problem solving in a way that modern games don't always acknowledge.  In more 'killer dungeon' type scenarios, some of the information could be life saving.  Some of these high level spells were there to force the DM to give you meta-game packets of help to get you through in one piece.  This is really good point, and I would like to think I would be among this group, inasmuch as I am in any 'optimizer' group.  I dislike trap options, but do not overly mind world building spells.  For instance, I don't have a problem with Illusory Script, as far as it goes.  I realize it is not something many adventurers would take, but it is flavorful and just something that Wizard's would have up their sleeve, both story wise and setting wise.  No one is going to take that spell and think that they are now just a World beater that can take on any dungeon or adventure.</blockquote>

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