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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Thanee" data-source="post: 1706901" data-attributes="member: 478">Well, magic gives the most options, right? I mean nothing is even close to how much magic gives in terms of options. More options = harder to assess a situation, thus it takes more effort to plan with that in mind.  I definitely notice, that in high level play, while I am surely very able to handle that, magic takes a considerable amount of time in the planning. Actually it's about the only thing, which requires any sort of effort at all.  The rest is so easy to take into consideration, that it takes only a neglectible amount of effort. At least, that's my experience. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />    Please note the "...". I mean free only in terms of actions, really.   Actually I have a very big problem agreeing with it... but I also know where the difference comes from... you are not taking non-combat into account.    The problem is, you are comparing combat only. Powers have a large impact on non-combat situations as well.  20 powers (I think that's the number they get at 20th level) are a huge asset.  Also, just because a psychic warrior is unbuffed at the beginning, doesn't mean he or she cannot make use of them in a combat, even if the manifestations actually cost actions, as it should be (IMHO).    Slightly!?  Note, this is when we ignore the time and effort needed to actually manifest them, just the result (as it will be, when you make the jump on someone else, i.e. pre-buffing available).  So, I agree, that an unbuffed psychic warrior, who cannot use any powers at all, would be an inferior fighter, obviously, but where's the point here?  How many psychic warriors do you know, who never use their powers? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />   A point, which you do not take into consideration, when you say an unbuffed psychic warrior is inferior to a fighter.    See above. No sighing necessary. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  I could also quote you, but you can look up your own posts above yourself, I guess. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />    I'm actually not quite sure, what they mean there... can you use Schism to manifest an extra power (i.e. Dispel Psionics), 6 PP below your maximum (can you use Overchannel/Talented with it?), without any metapsionics or anything else, which requires the use of psionic focus, once per round?  If so, then it's too much already.  BTW, I don't expect you to agree here, since you think it's fine, that haste effectively doubles the spellcasting power of a wizard or sorcerer (even if it cannot be cast "for free", aka starts to take effect one round later as you house ruled it).    If you have 18 available? If fighting is your primary purpose? No, not at all.   A major investment, yes, but "overspecialization" means to go beyond such reasonable borders to me (as clarified above). Major investment is completely fine.    Of course, especially later.  Maybe my position becomes more clear, when you look at it this way...  Take fighter (or whatever) levels 1 through 20.  Now look at the "usefulness" (i.e. on a scale of 1 to 10) of the class as a whole (taking some guesstimates, of course) for each of those levels.  Now multiply this "usefulness" by 1.5 for levels 6-10 and by 0.5 for levels 16-20, taking into account, at what levels this game is played the most (tho, actually, then the lowest levels should be weighed higher, but I specifically stay away from that, since they usually fly by faster than the higher levels (altho the system is not built like this, but also somewhat because set backs (level loss)), and any differences are still not very high at the lowest levels).  Add up together these 20 numbers and divide the sum by 20 to get an "overall usefulness".  This is roughly what I am looking at and what I am refering to as "the whole picture".  So, even if the fighter is completely useless at levels 16-20, which the class surely is not, that doesn't make much of a difference, since only few games compared to the whole play in this level range.  I totally agree, that the fighters usefulness degrades from level 10 on, mostly because they don't have any "high level abilities" at all, but that doesn't make the class useless as a whole, as you seem to claim.    I can, but the first does imply, that more then "just a bit" is needed to actually get there... <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />   Seriously, have you seen any wizard x who can easily keep up with a wizard x/prestige class y ? Any at all ?  It's a special case for wizards, however, as they lose nothing usually, except a feat and a few skill points, when entering a PrC, but gain lots of special abilities usually.  But to some extent, this is true for most PrC.  Also, I would still refer to a fighter x/prestige class y as a fighter, not only the single classed straight fighter.    Well, I wouldn't call Spell Focus a thrown away feat, most wizards tend to pick that up, anyways, and they need only 3 feats, really, 2 of which are Spell Focus. And at least for one specific character concept, Skill Focus: Spellcraft is also highly useful.  Bye Thanee</blockquote>

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