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Message: <blockquote data-quote="QuietBrowser" data-source="post: 7023083" data-attributes="member: 6855057">It's a basic fact; if you're a D&D fan, and you like the magic-user classes, you've almost certainly got at least one favorite School of Magic. For me, well, that School is undoubtedly Necromancy (with Evocation close behind).Why? I guess, at heart, it's a combination of n appreciation for darker settings and anti-hero types, and simply the fact that it just feels more "magical" to me. Enchantment and Illusion, I'm just too predisposed to writing off as comparatively mundane trickery by comparison - I guess a result of growing up reading Conan, where it's repeatedly stated that most hypnotic spells work in large part because of cultural indoctrination - whilst Divination has always felt too "NPC-focused" for me as a player.But, as much as I like playing a necromancer, I have to confess that D&D's treatment of it has been a bit... hit and miss.Whilst there's certainly an abundance of necromancy spells in total, they've tended to be scattered over sourcebooks, and as 5e currently doesn't have a "Complete Book of Necromancers", a "Libris Mortis", or even a "Complete Arcane", well, that leaves 5e Necromancers in particular with a fairly limited spellbook if they want to be thematic.I also have some issues with the kinds of spells traditionally lumped under necromancy. Namely, despite the school's association with destruction and death, it tends to be rather lacking in actual "blasty" type spells. Where's the ability to let out soul-withering ghostly screams, to freeze foes with the cold of the deepest grave, to scorch them with hellfire?And, of course, the biggest issue; the fact that D&D has had a long tradition of gimping the wizardly necromancer in favor of the clerical one, despite the fact that clerics are supposed to be the class specialized in fighting against the undead, with their mastery left to the fields of "those blasphemous, heathen wizards". This most famously manifested itself in the fact that the Necromancer was long inferior in terms of controlling the undead to an evil Cleric, courtesy of their "Control Undead" class feature, but it also manifesteds in a bias in spell allotment as well - seriously, can you believe that in 3rd edition, Create Undead was a Cleric-exclusive spell?I recently came into possession of a copy of Van Richten's Guide to the Walking Dead. It awakened in me my long-slumbering fondness for necromancers, and since I have some of D&D's big respositories of necromancy spells to hand (Complete Book of Necromancers, Libris Mortis, Player's Option: Heroes of Shadow), I thought I might try and update various spells from them, and perhaps some other "dark mage" flavored spells, such as those from the Book of Vile Darkness (and its Dragon #300 bonus spells) or Pathfinder's Horror Adventures. Maybe even try some completely homebrewed spell ideas that I've had boiling around, inspired by the likes of Warcraft and Sacrifice.But, as I read through the Guide to the Walking Dead, I began to wonder. It's a 3e sourcebook, but it's got a lot of interesting ideas. Ways of making undead more unique. The "Bind Undead" feats, which allow you to render undead you create permanently animated and loyal. The "Reign Undead" skill, which was used to teach undead to perform complicated tasks (essentially "Animal Handling for Necromancers").Moreover, it reminded me of my favorite kit from AD&D. The Undead Master was awesome, as it was the most "pulpy" Dark Mage wizard kit ever envisoned. For the price of giving up all but the barest minimum combat skill and access to three schools of magic (Alteration, Divination, Illusion), it gave you the usual Necromancer bonuses, let you cast Enchantment spells (ordinarily forbidden to a Necromancer), Control Undead as if you were an Evil Cleric of equivalent level, and Control Outsiders as if they were Undead of equivalent hit dice.Now, "I'm A Banana" was awesome by noting ways you could pull off this kit perfectly legitimately by just using the right blend of spells, backgrounds and feats, plus a homebrew feat for an added bit of "oomph", but still, it made me wonder if 5e doesn't have room for necromantic Prestige Classes, feats, alternate subclasses, skills, etc.Beyond that... I realised that for all my enthusiasm to convert spells, I actually am a rookie who could really use the input of others on the occasional bit of brainstorming. For example, I've heard that the Summon Undead spells from the Libris Mortis were held up as pretty awful back in 3.5 - why is that? And how can I fix that? For another, both VRGTWD and Libris Mortis contain a "create 5HD of undead per caster level" 9th level Necromancy spell for creating armies of minions. The Ravenloft version is called Army of Darkness and takes a day to cast, whilst the Libris Mortis one is dubbed Plague of Undeath and only takes an action. How do I choose which one to use? Can I maybe work them both in, just using different effects from casting? Heck, how am I supposed to handle the resultant undead horde - maybe have them create a "Zombie/Skeleton Swarm" instead?So, recognizing that I need the assistance and input of others for this little project, I start this topic here. If you're interested in fleshing out the necromancer's arsenal in 5e, please, I'd love to talk shop and swap ideas, see what we can do!</blockquote>

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