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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MostlyHarmless42" data-source="post: 7035023" data-attributes="member: 6845520">I do point out that the d&d 5e necromancer wizard and the death cleric have kind of swapped places in this edition. In editions past the cleric was more of the minion builder while the wizard necromancer was more about debuff and withering spells. I say withering rather than damage because necromancer itself has always been devised between necrotic style damage, self healing through damage, and ability drain type of stuff rather than just raw damage (that's evocation's thing). The problems we run into in 5e are a couple. First, the necromancer wizard is NOT the witherer anymore, the death cleric (and warlock...Albeit there really should be a true Lich patron, not just undying), and they accomplish this through spells like bane, hex, ray of exhaustion/sickness, etc. If you look at the death cleric ' features, they even get raw necrotic blasts as their channel abilities, and spirit guardians is literally an aoe necrotic blast spell with ghosts tearing apart your enemies! The warlock list likewise screams a cool "dread necro" feel (who says your eldritch blasts arent ghostly skulls? Again, it just lacks a true focused patron, undying is close though). Part of the disconnect from previous editions aside from the above role switch also is that 5th in general has less stacking debuffs which makes hyper focused characters not as viable anymore. I'll agree perhaps a spell or two that reduces max enemy health (the new ability drain) might be warrented, though that could be situational at best as most enemies you only encounter once.The necromancer wizard in this edition is without a doubt a minion builder, not the "blasty necromancer". You can totally still take and cast fireball, fly, or other wizard spells. Though the wizard being forced to use spell slots in a balance thing. Minions are powerful (and more importantly take a lot of time each turn to roll dice for), hence this was stuck in as al balancing factor. What you are all so not bringing up is that Animate Dead no longer has all son expensive material cost, so who cares if your zombies die? You can always find more bandits or a graveyard. And with the necromancer abilities they are less likely to do so compared to the death cleric.</blockquote>

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