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Message: <blockquote data-quote="RainOfSteel" data-source="post: 5660565" data-attributes="member: 24460">If it had been submitted to a magazine that didn't exist at the time?  Really?Paizo?  The above assertion about Dungeon is already invalid, but this one goes even further down this road.Basically what you're saying here: if Q1 had been done later, it wouldn't have been well-regarded.If Star Wars had been released today, it would not have anywhere near the success it did.You created false expectations for yourself and then you dashed them.No more so than the G1-3 or D1-3.  There were only so many pages in each module.Whether it was a terror or not is a personal matter, but to criticize a dungeon module for having a dungeon in it is a bit much.Not to beat a dead horse, well, yes, to beat a dead horse: there were only so many pages, there simply wasn't room to do that.It wasn't the whole Abyss, it was just one corner of it.  Also, back then, nobody knew what the Abyss was "like", so all of this type of expectations-based disappointment on your part is moot (beyond you).I certainly brought no such expectations to the table when I read Q1.Over and over again you are putting modern glasses on when attempting to create critical points.That is a legitimate comment, however, I feel that "nothing" is not accurate.Intelligent players could find allies in some of those other worlds to fight against Lolth, as well as to rest, get healing, and for clerics to pick up spells as the rules were, I believe, that clerics could not refresh spells above level 2 while in the Abyss.  So, actually, those other worlds were key player restoration and resupply points.The players are chasing Lolth because of interference on Oerth through the drow elves.  Through the other worlds, the players get to see that the demon goddess is out for more than just them.Those other worlds were great sparks of imagination.For the lower levels of the Demonweb, I'll give it to you that most of your comments are correct, but I disagree with your conclusions.I did not see any encounters in the lower levels of the Demonweb that were, in any way, inferior to what was presented in G1-3 and D1-3.  Not better, but not inferior.  D1-3 had wild inconsistencies in power levels, from the weak to the immensely strong, splattered about in both set and random encounters.As made obvious further above, I found the top level of the Demonweb to be extremely interesting and necessary to the adventure.The spider ship was also a bit wonky, but it was the Abyss, you know, the place of Chaos, which also includes randomness and the unexpected.  To me, this sort of thing was to be expected.I'll give it to you that there was no story whatsoever involved in any part of Q1 beyond following up on finding Lolth due to G1-3/D1-3 (and A1-4 earlier on if you ran that).  While I am ready to admit it would have been an improvement had this occurred, I am also ready to admit that the storyline in G1-3/D1-3, while it fired the imagination, was itself fairly thin to begin with.  This issue is hardly worth shooting down Q1 given that G1-3/D1-3 hardly did better.I always thought it was a walker, not a spaceship.  [Goes off to read Q1: Yup, it's a walker.]Who said she isn't also known by that?  It just wasn't covered in the 32 page module.Was that even established then?In any event, she's a force of Chaos, does whatever she wants, and the stranger it seems to you, the happier she becomes: with evil sprinkles on top.You mean, like all of D1-3 did with all that drow adamantite magic gear that disintegrated when taken back home?This topic is the first time I've heard anyone come down on Q1.It's just strange seeing it get boosted over so many years and in so many "best" modules topics (yes, right along with G1-3/D1-3), but nobody, not once, in this contentious nitpicky world of message boards, ever stopped to single out Q1 as being the boat anchor of the mega adventure.I've never run into someone in RL who didn't like Q1.I guess I'm just the hick in from the countryside.Sounds good.  I'm expecting three 32 page modules from you, with maps sufficient to cover three sets of double covers.</blockquote>

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