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Question on diagonal movement with minatures (or VTT)
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<blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 8029312" data-attributes="member: 6987520"><p>I agree that by RAW your DM is incorrect on both accounts: you are not moving through a space occupied by the minotaur and even if another enemy was at the 10 ft square space, you can move along diagonals so you would not be stopped by that either.</p><p></p><p>One thing I think people sometimes forget when dealing with grids (either VTT or minis) is the space a creature "occupies" is not literally <em>filled</em> by that creature. This is why you can move through a non-hostile creature's space, you just can't end your move in their space. If you think about an elevator that might be 5' x 5', you could have 4-5 people standing in it without any issue (might be a bit tight, but not too bad really) despite D&D's medium creature occupying that entire space. It is also the reason why creatures can move through a space one-size category smaller than what they would normally occupy, they just spend extra movement while in smaller spaces and have disadvantage on attack rolls and DEX saves.</p><p></p><p>So, while the minotaur occupies a 10' x 10' space, there is plenty of room inside that area. Without optional rules from the DMG for Overrun or Tumble (pg. 272), you cannot move through the minotaur's space unless you are Small (or Tiny) or Gargantuan. However, since characters can move diagonally (not just horizontally and vertically), the blue knight is moving <em>around </em>the Minotaur's space, not through a square occupied by the minotaur.</p><p></p><p>However, if we change the map a bit and the double-black lines represented a wall, you would have to follow the red path, and you <em>would</em> be going through a square that is actually occupied by the minotaur. If your tables uses the optional Overrun or Tumble rules, you could try to move to the minotaur's space (white circle), and if you are successful continue moving along the red path. If your table doesn't use the Overrun/Tumble rules, you would have to go completely around the minotaur.</p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]123435[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>Finally, if you are using optional rules fo Overrun and Tumble, your table might want to adopt the optional rule for diagonal movement from the DMG pg. 252. The first diagonal counts as 5, then next 10, then 5 again, and so on, repeating. If you followed that, the blue knight would only move to here (the yellow arc showing about 30 ft of movement). As you can see, the diagonal rule works pretty well IMO:</p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]123436[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>Anyway, ultimately it is up to the DM and the table to discuss how you want movement to work in such cases and to make certain both the DM and players are consistent. You should point out that the blue knight was not threatened by the minotaur, and you <em>are</em> using your action to disengage to move safely by it. You could have just as easily moved and <em>dashed</em>, completely avoiding the minotaur and all squares around it.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="DND_Reborn, post: 8029312, member: 6987520"] I agree that by RAW your DM is incorrect on both accounts: you are not moving through a space occupied by the minotaur and even if another enemy was at the 10 ft square space, you can move along diagonals so you would not be stopped by that either. One thing I think people sometimes forget when dealing with grids (either VTT or minis) is the space a creature "occupies" is not literally [I]filled[/I] by that creature. This is why you can move through a non-hostile creature's space, you just can't end your move in their space. If you think about an elevator that might be 5' x 5', you could have 4-5 people standing in it without any issue (might be a bit tight, but not too bad really) despite D&D's medium creature occupying that entire space. It is also the reason why creatures can move through a space one-size category smaller than what they would normally occupy, they just spend extra movement while in smaller spaces and have disadvantage on attack rolls and DEX saves. So, while the minotaur occupies a 10' x 10' space, there is plenty of room inside that area. Without optional rules from the DMG for Overrun or Tumble (pg. 272), you cannot move through the minotaur's space unless you are Small (or Tiny) or Gargantuan. However, since characters can move diagonally (not just horizontally and vertically), the blue knight is moving [I]around [/I]the Minotaur's space, not through a square occupied by the minotaur. However, if we change the map a bit and the double-black lines represented a wall, you would have to follow the red path, and you [I]would[/I] be going through a square that is actually occupied by the minotaur. If your tables uses the optional Overrun or Tumble rules, you could try to move to the minotaur's space (white circle), and if you are successful continue moving along the red path. If your table doesn't use the Overrun/Tumble rules, you would have to go completely around the minotaur. [ATTACH type="full" alt="1593955633113.png"]123435[/ATTACH] Finally, if you are using optional rules fo Overrun and Tumble, your table might want to adopt the optional rule for diagonal movement from the DMG pg. 252. The first diagonal counts as 5, then next 10, then 5 again, and so on, repeating. If you followed that, the blue knight would only move to here (the yellow arc showing about 30 ft of movement). As you can see, the diagonal rule works pretty well IMO: [ATTACH type="full" alt="1593958241520.png"]123436[/ATTACH] Anyway, ultimately it is up to the DM and the table to discuss how you want movement to work in such cases and to make certain both the DM and players are consistent. You should point out that the blue knight was not threatened by the minotaur, and you [I]are[/I] using your action to disengage to move safely by it. You could have just as easily moved and [I]dashed[/I], completely avoiding the minotaur and all squares around it. [/QUOTE]
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