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<blockquote data-quote="PlzBreakMyCampaign" data-source="post: 4969437" data-attributes="member: 85724">You have an extra level of fighter. You are comparing the dead level of fighter in the ECL0 race to the useful level of fighter in the LA'd race...Also if you actually play characters with 3 levels of fighter, then I would say you NEED that extra power boost. Its pretty common knowledge that classes are the only large source of power in DnD. Without class levels, you will not be able to compete. Remember that the LA still counts (in addition to excessive HD), which is usually pretty heavy deterant itself.Though yes, throwing out the HD is a step in a direction I support. Also I don't play at ECL3. ECL 12-15 is where I like it. Once 6th and 8th level spells are available, 50% efficiency HD, bab that doesn't help prereq's and a feat or two that cuts into your normal amount starts to look not worth lagging behind in class levels. But I do Dm with tier 1 and 2 class <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool&nbsp; &nbsp; :cool:"&nbsp; data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" /> (actually the LA+0 character was the most powerful in my last all non-human, because he played a caster). Camparing melee, while it looks 'normal' isn't how DnD usually ends up played without severe, targeted nerfing; so no point comparing there...</blockquote>

[QUOTE="PlzBreakMyCampaign, post: 4969437, member: 85724"] You have an extra level of fighter. You are comparing the dead level of fighter in the ECL0 race to the useful level of fighter in the LA'd race... Also if you actually play characters with 3 levels of fighter, then I would say you NEED that extra power boost. Its pretty common knowledge that classes are the only large source of power in DnD. Without class levels, you will not be able to compete. Remember that the LA still counts (in addition to excessive HD), which is usually pretty heavy deterant itself. Though yes, throwing out the HD is a step in a direction I support. Also I don't play at ECL3. ECL 12-15 is where I like it. Once 6th and 8th level spells are available, 50% efficiency HD, bab that doesn't help prereq's and a feat or two that cuts into your normal amount starts to look not worth lagging behind in class levels. But I do Dm with tier 1 and 2 class :cool: (actually the LA+0 character was the most powerful in my last all non-human, because he played a caster). Camparing melee, while it looks 'normal' isn't how DnD usually ends up played without severe, targeted nerfing; so no point comparing there... [/QUOTE]

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