Rage against Static DCs!!!

[green slime]

I've just been perusing the Magic Item Compendium

And still, after all these years of 3.x DND, some designer still thinks items with static DC's would be remotely interesting to possess. Please, Designers, take note: Static DC's suck canine flatulence!! Players do not create scrolls with offensive spells, because the DC's suck. The staff, long a feature of fantasy, has been reduced to a gp siphon or minor gimmick. Who is interested in spending hard earned dosh for an item with a static DC of 14?

All these items, should instead base their DC on the user's force of personality, Charisma, as well as their level (*0.5) . This means that Charisma can no longer be regarded as a dump stat for any class. Staves, become interesting again, and may actually be worth the investment. The "Fearsome" armour property, may actually be worth +15,000 gp, regardless of your level.

 

[WhatGravitas]

The staff, long a feature of fantasy, has been reduced to a gp siphon or minor gimmick.

Minor nitpick:

Staffs use the wielder’s ability score and relevant feats to set the DC for saves against their spells. Unlike with other sorts of magic items, the wielder can use his caster level when activating the power of a staff if it’s higher than the caster level of the staff.

This means that staffs are far more potent in the hands of a powerful spellcaster. Because they use the wielder’s ability score to set the save DC for the spell, spells from a staff are often harder to resist than ones from other magic items, which use the minimum ability score required to cast the spell. Not only are aspects of the spell dependant on caster level (range, duration, and so on) potentially higher, but spells from a staff are harder to dispel and have a better chance of overcoming a target’s spell resistance.

(source)

 

[Planeswalker Maloran]

Agreed, though. There are far too many items with static DCs, and the DC is always far too low to be worth it for a player who's high enough level to afford such an item (assuming standard gold per encounter).

I've got a similar complain with poisons. I'm used to thinking of poison as something that will likely kill you, or if not, at least make you seriously ill. Most poisons are pretty low DC for any character above 3rd or 4th level with a halfway decent Constitution. I really think that poisons should allow a save for half damage, rather than a save for no effect. A poison that does 3d6 Con damage to a mid-level wizard should not be completely harmless to a high-level fighter.

 

[Jack Simth]

Agreed, though. There are far too many items with static DCs, and the DC is always far too low to be worth it for a player who's high enough level to afford such an item (assuming standard gold per encounter).

Yeah, say that after four slaying arrows applicable to you hit you in a single round.

With a lot of items, a scaling DC would be a nightmare (for the players) as it's a simple matter to force quite a few saves. Someone with Eyes of Petrification, a Robe of Scintilating colors, and pumping off a few appropriate slaying arrows each round, is liable to win if the DCs scale. A Wizard can't force as many save or die effects per round on the same target as a well-equipped archer.

Static DC's do a couple of things:

1) They prevent scrolls and wands from being the be-all, end-all of endurance runs; the Wizard/Sorcerer is still limited by spell slots for effective attacking (mostly; things with no saving throw like Enervation and Scorching ray, or "suck even if you save" spells like Web, are exceptions).
2) They cut down on the number of saves you need to make each round.
3) They help keep player character's alive.

I've got a similar complain with poisons. I'm used to thinking of poison as something that will likely kill you, or if not, at least make you seriously ill. Most poisons are pretty low DC for any character above 3rd or 4th level with a halfway decent Constitution. I really think that poisons should allow a save for half damage, rather than a save for no effect. A poison that does 3d6 Con damage to a mid-level wizard should not be completely harmless to a high-level fighter.

Well, levels 1-3 are expected to represent the majority of humanity; 4th extraordinary individuals, 5th the kind of person that comes along once in a generation. Most people will suffer very badly even from the mild poisons.

That 10th level Fighter is going to be SOMEBODY. He'll take on a tank with a sword, and win. He'll be the undisputed champion in both boxing and wrestling until he chooses to retire. He'll routinely survive attempts on his life for the simple reason that he can shrug off (or avoid - depends on how you interpert hit points) most gunshots and throw a dagger into the heart of his attacker for fifty feet away. Sure, he can shrug off some nasty, nasty stuff... but he can anyway.

Sure, the core poisons only go up to DC 26 (Dragon Bile, Contact Initial 3d6 Str, secondary 0).

But quite frankly, if the poisons were save for half, then poisons become the name of the game. On average, four doses of Black Lotus Extract (3d6 con primary, 3d6 con secondary) will kill basically anything that's subject to it, even assuming all saves are made (average of about 5 con damage initially on a successful save - 20 con damage is nothing to sneeze at; if you're a fan of the secondary damage still applying, that goes up to 40 average con damage). Sure, that's 20k... but it'll take down most dragons, even if they make all their saves. A Cheap injury poison (medium spider venom, for instance) goes very well on the hasted archer's arrows (or better, the hasted slinger's bullets); magic bow and special material arrows penetrate DR, little old DC 14 1d4 strength damage quickly reduces the target to ineffectiveness (as they always take half damage, regardless).

Meanwhile, Delay Poison is a 2nd level Cleric spell, accessable at 3rd; Detect Poison is a Cantrip/Osiron. Neutralize Poison is 4th, but that can be saved for after the danger's past, and used off of a scroll if poison is present in the target's system. Once 6th level Cleric spells are available, everyone's immune to poison anyway by way of Heroes' Feast.

 

[airwalkrr]

My house rules on the subject:

-All use-activated magic items have a save DC of 10 + 1/2 user's HD + user's Charisma modifier.
-All spell-trigger and spell-completion items have a save DC of 10 + 1/2 user's caster level + user's key ability modifier for that spell (e.g. Int for wizards).
-Wands cost 1,500 gp x spell level squared and scrolls cost 50 gp x spell level squared.
-Artifacts, rather than having a high static DC, simply grant a bonus to the save DC; +5 for minor artifacts, +10 for major artifacts.

Seems to work pretty well.