Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
(Rambling) Why 4e doesn't "feel" 1e...
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Remathilis" data-source="post: 4504807" data-attributes="member: 7635"><p>All of which makes me wonder...</p><p></p><p>Is there a way to achieve the magic/martial unreliable/reliable split AND even out fighters loosing effectiveness to wizards at high level?</p><p></p><p>Prior to 4e, a wizard was supposedly balanced by fire-and-forget magic. The problem is, wizards continued to get spell slots (both higher level and more lower level) so that a 9th level wizard had 18 spells slots (0-5th level) before bonus spells for high Int, specialization, and magical items. Assuming 3e's "Five encounters and rest", a typical 9th level mage with an 18 int had 22 spells to use across 5 encounters. That means he could cast one spell a round for four rounds per combat and just be sitting with a few of cantrips left. Most combats rarely went more rounds than that, negating the fighter's "all day long" balancing factor. (This also ignores any magic item like wands, staves, and scrolls which allow additional spellcasting beyond those 22 slots).</p><p></p><p>Beyond severly limiting spells/day or boosting fighter power (both of which 4e did) I'm not sure how to counter the fact few high-level mages are "powerful but limited" because they really aren't. The only thing I can think of was having more "save negates/SR" effects, but that can get frustrating for the mage ("My spells NEVER work"). </p><p></p><p>Hmmm...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Remathilis, post: 4504807, member: 7635"] All of which makes me wonder... Is there a way to achieve the magic/martial unreliable/reliable split AND even out fighters loosing effectiveness to wizards at high level? Prior to 4e, a wizard was supposedly balanced by fire-and-forget magic. The problem is, wizards continued to get spell slots (both higher level and more lower level) so that a 9th level wizard had 18 spells slots (0-5th level) before bonus spells for high Int, specialization, and magical items. Assuming 3e's "Five encounters and rest", a typical 9th level mage with an 18 int had 22 spells to use across 5 encounters. That means he could cast one spell a round for four rounds per combat and just be sitting with a few of cantrips left. Most combats rarely went more rounds than that, negating the fighter's "all day long" balancing factor. (This also ignores any magic item like wands, staves, and scrolls which allow additional spellcasting beyond those 22 slots). Beyond severly limiting spells/day or boosting fighter power (both of which 4e did) I'm not sure how to counter the fact few high-level mages are "powerful but limited" because they really aren't. The only thing I can think of was having more "save negates/SR" effects, but that can get frustrating for the mage ("My spells NEVER work"). Hmmm... [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
(Rambling) Why 4e doesn't "feel" 1e...
Top