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Message: <blockquote data-quote="loisel" data-source="post: 4260648" data-attributes="member: 10135">I'm not gonna make a complete rogue to answer this question, but my sense is that rogue is between lock and ranger. But let's do a quick back-of-the-envelope comparison at level 10.pluses: rogue d8 backstabs with the feat (instead of d6 for lock), and rogue backstab at level 10 is 2d8 instead of 1d6 (lock) or 1d8 (ranger). For this comparison only, I will include backstab/quarry/curse damage.minuses: rogue need to use light blades for most of their powers. Light blades suck. If rogues had iterative attacks, light blades would suck less, but rogues have single attacks for the most part. I'll assume a rapier (1d8).For level 9 dailies, Knockout knocks the victim unconscious, and from there you can try to get fancy (e.g. a hit is automatically a critical), but it's not real unconsciousness because they wake up if you hit them. So let's keep things simple.Crimson edge is 2[W]+dex, and 5+str ongoing. Add the 2d8 backstab and assume 2 rounds of ongoing. Assume dex=20, str=18. Assume +2 weapon and weapon focus (+1 damage). Max damage is 58 (counting backstab).Lock has 48+6=54 and ranger has 78+8=86.So yeah, rogue is a bit better than lock, but not as good as ranger.Yeah, in fact, not very close to ranger!</blockquote>