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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Rant on the 4E "Presentation"
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<blockquote data-quote="gizmo33" data-source="post: 3832324" data-attributes="member: 30001"><p>Nobody's squawking. I think that's disrespectful, but I'm not even exactly sure what the animal noise metaphor suggests. There are plenty of concerns posted and they're not all animal-noise related. Basically, it advances nothing in the conversation to assume the worst case scenario. If someone is being rude or vague in what they're saying, then that's a problem independant of the general category of what it is they are complaining about, and doesn't make the case either way IMO. In other words - if someone walks up to the counter at McDs and screams at the cashier that he would like a lobster, that's not a condemnation of the principle that customers ought to be able to order what they want.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The one is a statement and the other is a question so I don't see how one is putting the other one differently unless the question is rhetorical. But I don't think the question is rhetorical and there are probably tons of ways to request feedback on design issues. Software companies do this all of the time with major releases of development environments/software. They ship out beta versions, get feedback, make modifications, etc. I'm not an IP lawyer, and I don't have to pay WotCs salaries, so what I generally feel could be possible would have to be developed by people with the experience and money to do so.</p><p></p><p>And in the end, there are still going to be cranks complaining about things. But not even trying because of a few cranks IMO is overly sensitive for a public company. The bulk of the population could probably be tapped for input in a constructive way by people who were knowledgable in doing so. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Take the OGL for instance. Do you "blame" pre-3E game designers for not having done something like this? I'm sure they have their reasons for why they didn't do it. What is worth it? I guess that depends on what their priorities were/are. Certainly there are down-sides to the OGL, but it's really a matter of what your priorities are. </p><p></p><p>WotC and the industry in general is not infallible. So are they doing everything right in terms of getting community input for the new game? I doubt it, just based on probabilities. They'll have to be smart about how they do this stuff, but if Hasbro can't tell the difference between RPGs and board games in terms of the way the consumer is involved, I would think they would need to understand that first (realizing of course, that no one from WotC is involved in this question of whether or not customer input is important AFAIK).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="gizmo33, post: 3832324, member: 30001"] Nobody's squawking. I think that's disrespectful, but I'm not even exactly sure what the animal noise metaphor suggests. There are plenty of concerns posted and they're not all animal-noise related. Basically, it advances nothing in the conversation to assume the worst case scenario. If someone is being rude or vague in what they're saying, then that's a problem independant of the general category of what it is they are complaining about, and doesn't make the case either way IMO. In other words - if someone walks up to the counter at McDs and screams at the cashier that he would like a lobster, that's not a condemnation of the principle that customers ought to be able to order what they want. The one is a statement and the other is a question so I don't see how one is putting the other one differently unless the question is rhetorical. But I don't think the question is rhetorical and there are probably tons of ways to request feedback on design issues. Software companies do this all of the time with major releases of development environments/software. They ship out beta versions, get feedback, make modifications, etc. I'm not an IP lawyer, and I don't have to pay WotCs salaries, so what I generally feel could be possible would have to be developed by people with the experience and money to do so. And in the end, there are still going to be cranks complaining about things. But not even trying because of a few cranks IMO is overly sensitive for a public company. The bulk of the population could probably be tapped for input in a constructive way by people who were knowledgable in doing so. Take the OGL for instance. Do you "blame" pre-3E game designers for not having done something like this? I'm sure they have their reasons for why they didn't do it. What is worth it? I guess that depends on what their priorities were/are. Certainly there are down-sides to the OGL, but it's really a matter of what your priorities are. WotC and the industry in general is not infallible. So are they doing everything right in terms of getting community input for the new game? I doubt it, just based on probabilities. They'll have to be smart about how they do this stuff, but if Hasbro can't tell the difference between RPGs and board games in terms of the way the consumer is involved, I would think they would need to understand that first (realizing of course, that no one from WotC is involved in this question of whether or not customer input is important AFAIK). [/QUOTE]
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