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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Quickbeam" data-source="post: 169436" data-attributes="member: 635">Most (if not all) of us have encountered players such as the ones you are referring to, with an equal level of frustration and sadness.  As Pielorinho and Crothian have noted, most gamers go through a gimmicky phase in character creation, but the type of player you're dealing with is a whole different breed.  In my case, after reading last June's Dragon #284 I decided to create a half-dragon paladin for my PC as I transitioned from DM to player.  I consulted with the new DM and several other players in the group about using a template race character, and everyone supported the idea.  In fact, most of the group was curious to see how such unusual characters worked in terms of game balance with the ECL rules, etc.  I will admit that such PC's can make the game a bit quirky at times, but the gimmicky characters aren't the problem -- as I'm sure you well know.The problem is players who have no regard for game balance or the enjoyment of others...let's call them selfish jerks, shall we?  Selfish jerks are unlikely to respond to constructive criticism, intelligent conversations, or other useful endeavours to restore order within the game.  They'd create havoc using a standard human cleric or dwarven fighter because that's their nature.  I'm sorry that you're games have been fraught with so many of these folks, AFGNCAAP.  If reasonable attempts (any of the suggestions already posted in this thread) to maintain party balance and group enjoyment have failed, then hopefully you'll find a game without these annoying elements.  Don't allow these dinks (to use a Teflon Billy term) to force you into quitting a hobby you enjoy <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f641.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":(" title="Frown    :("  data-smilie="3"data-shortname=":(" /> .</blockquote>

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