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<blockquote data-quote="AlViking" data-source="post: 9678380" data-attributes="member: 6906980">It's a failure completely unrelated to the failed climb check. That's the whole issue here.&nbsp; I want a game where if you failed the climb check the only result is that you don't climb the cliff.&nbsp; The only possible negative to that failed check is that you may take damage as a result of falling.If the friend dies because I didn't get to them in time, it was not caused by us not getting to them in time.&nbsp; They died because there was some kind of ticking clock that the players may or may not have been aware of.&nbsp; The friend was killed by the cultists, succumbed to poison, disease or something else.&nbsp; If the character had successfully climbed the cliff they may have had time to prevent the friend's death but the death was in no way caused by the character's actions or failure to climb the cliff.&nbsp; The attempt to save the friend's life would have been a completely different set of actions and decisions.This is a pretty fundamental difference to approach and what we want out of the game.&nbsp; I do not run a game that is focused on the narrative, I run a game that is focused on simulation of characters in a fantasy world.&nbsp; Of course I put things in that will be interesting and usually level appropriate because it is still a game.&nbsp; But if there is failure or success the results will follow the fiction of the world, not what moves the story forward or not.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AlViking, post: 9678380, member: 6906980"] It's a failure completely unrelated to the failed climb check. That's the whole issue here. I want a game where if you failed the climb check the only result is that you don't climb the cliff. The only possible negative to that failed check is that you may take damage as a result of falling. If the friend dies because I didn't get to them in time, it was not caused by us not getting to them in time. They died because there was some kind of ticking clock that the players may or may not have been aware of. The friend was killed by the cultists, succumbed to poison, disease or something else. If the character had successfully climbed the cliff they may have had time to prevent the friend's death but the death was in no way caused by the character's actions or failure to climb the cliff. The attempt to save the friend's life would have been a completely different set of actions and decisions. This is a pretty fundamental difference to approach and what we want out of the game. I do not run a game that is focused on the narrative, I run a game that is focused on simulation of characters in a fantasy world. Of course I put things in that will be interesting and usually level appropriate because it is still a game. But if there is failure or success the results will follow the fiction of the world, not what moves the story forward or not. [/QUOTE]

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