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[rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.
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<blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 9714386" data-attributes="member: 6790260"><p>Okay, but do you not see how all of this still comes back to "this is the Lanefan-specific thing"?</p><p></p><p>Someone coming to this with no knowledge except what 5e is (whichever version, both include playable drow) wouldn't know these things. Meaning, as I already argued, explaining yourself is kinda important. You need to <em>get the player on board</em>, not shout at them that you're pulling rank and they'd better fall in line.</p><p></p><p></p><p>AIUI, formally, there isn't one. But for my own personal concept, I would say Ghostwise halflings.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Okay. The problem is, several of the species that <em>have been</em> "monsters" really do look exactly like "demonized groups of IRL humans". Orcs are another good example, because (unfortunately) from their very inception, they've had some unfortunate Orientalist tropes woven into their story, and a big part of why they're getting a huge injection of nuance is...we'd like to keep what makes orcs cool, without making them "see, <em>these</em> humans are okay to murder indiscriminately because we asserted that they're a different species, and they're green!" Because that has unfortunately been an all-too-common failing of human nature across history.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Which is super cool! I love that stuff.</p><p></p><p>To add perhaps a bit of clarity to my previous stuff, "monsters" include things like mindflayers (inherently horrible creatures that literally need to murder to live), undead, constructs, vampires, and things like mutants. Now, one <em>can</em> change the concept and demonstrate the truly inhuman nature of something that hasn't been super great in the past, e.g. actually <em>showing</em> that one's "orcs" are grown in labs and programmed by fantasy computers or the like. (Though even then, there's something to be said for "why does it need to be 'orcs' then? Couldn't it just be human clones altered to be mindless shock troops?" Aka, one can do a lot with pig leather, but there comes a point where one must recognize it won't make a silk purse.)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="EzekielRaiden, post: 9714386, member: 6790260"] Okay, but do you not see how all of this still comes back to "this is the Lanefan-specific thing"? Someone coming to this with no knowledge except what 5e is (whichever version, both include playable drow) wouldn't know these things. Meaning, as I already argued, explaining yourself is kinda important. You need to [I]get the player on board[/I], not shout at them that you're pulling rank and they'd better fall in line. AIUI, formally, there isn't one. But for my own personal concept, I would say Ghostwise halflings. Okay. The problem is, several of the species that [I]have been[/I] "monsters" really do look exactly like "demonized groups of IRL humans". Orcs are another good example, because (unfortunately) from their very inception, they've had some unfortunate Orientalist tropes woven into their story, and a big part of why they're getting a huge injection of nuance is...we'd like to keep what makes orcs cool, without making them "see, [I]these[/I] humans are okay to murder indiscriminately because we asserted that they're a different species, and they're green!" Because that has unfortunately been an all-too-common failing of human nature across history. Which is super cool! I love that stuff. To add perhaps a bit of clarity to my previous stuff, "monsters" include things like mindflayers (inherently horrible creatures that literally need to murder to live), undead, constructs, vampires, and things like mutants. Now, one [I]can[/I] change the concept and demonstrate the truly inhuman nature of something that hasn't been super great in the past, e.g. actually [I]showing[/I] that one's "orcs" are grown in labs and programmed by fantasy computers or the like. (Though even then, there's something to be said for "why does it need to be 'orcs' then? Couldn't it just be human clones altered to be mindless shock troops?" Aka, one can do a lot with pig leather, but there comes a point where one must recognize it won't make a silk purse.) [/QUOTE]
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[rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.
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