NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!

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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AlViking" data-source="post: 9714628" data-attributes="member: 6906980">Anything that happens in the fiction and is only in the fiction is diegetic.  If the minor character exists in the fiction they are diegetic.Correct, the voice of the omnipotent narrator "They did not know what was to come..." or the Jaws theme music is not diegetic because it doesn't exist in the fiction.On the other hand, the camera crew or the director of a film are neither diegetic or non-diegetic, they exist in order to bring the story to life for the audience.If a character in D&D casts Control Weather and causes rain it is diegetic because the character caused it.  But events don't have to be under the control of or created by the characters in the story. If it's raining in the fictional world, it's diegetic.I don't see how this is hard.  Look it up in the dictionary, diegetic is clearly defined "existing or occurring within the world of a narrative rather than as something external to that world".  The GM playing theme music, not diegetic. People hearing mysterious music of an unknown origin as they wander through the woods, diegetic.  The GM narrating what's going on, using dice to resolve uncertainty, the player saying what the character does?  Neither diegetic or non-diegetic, those things have to happen in order for there to be a game, much like the cameras and director for a film.  But changes to the fiction of the world? From the player side it's because the characters make it happen.  From the GM side they're either reacting to what actions the characters did or what they said.  There are many other things that the GM also narrates because it's a living world with other events, NPCs and creatures also coming into play.  Not being diegetic, not being simulationist is not a negative.  If the player can accumulate meta-points and spend those meta-points to change the fiction in some way they find beneficial or more interesting, go for it. If the GM wants to use fail forward techniques where failure means something other than "nothing happens", if the players and the GM are constantly adding to the fiction of the world, all sorts of things can happen in game that are not diegetic, not simulationist.  If the people at the table are enjoying the game then it's working.  I just prefer a more simulationist approach.  As GM I am creating the world and populating it but once the session starts I stick to what I had established as much as possible.  As a player I want my impacts on the world to be limited to what I say and do, no meta-points for me.</blockquote>

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