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Message: <blockquote data-quote="dave2008" data-source="post: 7888011" data-attributes="member: 83242">Close, what I am saying is that 5e & PF2e monsters are pretty much the same, just the PF2e system notches up difficulty, complexity and tactical options. As I have mentioned several times, there is almost no difference in the 5e orc and the PF2e orc warrior.  This is one example, but it is not the only one.  I find a lot of similarities between equivalent monsters between the two books.  I think what you are describing is how well the PF2e monsters take advantage of the PF2e system to make a better combat experience. Really, I think our difference stems from what we consider "monster design," not the end results.  I have a much more narrow definition of monster design, I think.  Basically, I think you are correct under your definition and I am correct under my definition.I've tried for a few months and failed to find a group.  If one falls into my lap I will, but I am done looking for a bit.  RL concerns and all.  Might suggest a one-shot with my current 5e group, but they have not liked the idea when I suggested it to them before.  But I can keep trying!</blockquote>