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<blockquote data-quote="Mengu" data-source="post: 4657637" data-attributes="member: 65726">Sure Strike and Careful Attack were coined to be the weakest fighter and ranger at-will powers respectively, when the PHB was first released. I'm just wondering if anything has changed, if anything in the current player arsenal makes these powers stronger.&nbsp;Let's look at Exotic Fighting Style. Here are the relevant bits of the feat:&nbsp;&nbsp;For a race that does not get a strength bonus, like a Tiefling or Elf fighter with 16 strength, if they grab a Bastard Sword and Exotic Fighting Style, Sure Strike suddenly becomes an at-will power that gives them a +2 attack bonus with virtually no penalty to damage.&nbsp;Let's take a look at Grudge Style:&nbsp;&nbsp;For a Dwarf Battlerager who has difficulty hitting, and gets hit frequently, Sure Strike will boost that chance to hit significantly, and by using Wisdom for damage instead of Strength, he is not giving up too much damage, for that significant +2 to attack.&nbsp;Careful Attack got a somewhat interesting option as well. Let's look at True Arrow Style:&nbsp;&nbsp;The reason Twin Strike is so good is because it makes sure you get two chances to apply Hunter's Quarry damage. Careful Attack + True Arrow Style, essentially gives you a +2 to that first attack roll, and should you miss, your second attack gets to add your dexterity modifier to damage. However, Twin Strike can target 2 separate enemies, might hit twice, and does not grant enemies CA against you. So it doesn't quite seem like worth the feat to turn Careful attack into a weaker Twin Strike. And if you look at what some of the arena style feats do for Twin Strike in melee, Careful Attack is still quite the underdog in that department as well.&nbsp;So, can you think of some other abilities that might turn Sure Strike and Careful attack into interesting (if not optimal) options?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Mengu, post: 4657637, member: 65726"] Sure Strike and Careful Attack were coined to be the weakest fighter and ranger at-will powers respectively, when the PHB was first released. I'm just wondering if anything has changed, if anything in the current player arsenal makes these powers stronger. Let's look at Exotic Fighting Style. Here are the relevant bits of the feat: For a race that does not get a strength bonus, like a Tiefling or Elf fighter with 16 strength, if they grab a Bastard Sword and Exotic Fighting Style, Sure Strike suddenly becomes an at-will power that gives them a +2 attack bonus with virtually no penalty to damage. Let's take a look at Grudge Style: For a Dwarf Battlerager who has difficulty hitting, and gets hit frequently, Sure Strike will boost that chance to hit significantly, and by using Wisdom for damage instead of Strength, he is not giving up too much damage, for that significant +2 to attack. Careful Attack got a somewhat interesting option as well. Let's look at True Arrow Style: The reason Twin Strike is so good is because it makes sure you get two chances to apply Hunter's Quarry damage. Careful Attack + True Arrow Style, essentially gives you a +2 to that first attack roll, and should you miss, your second attack gets to add your dexterity modifier to damage. However, Twin Strike can target 2 separate enemies, might hit twice, and does not grant enemies CA against you. So it doesn't quite seem like worth the feat to turn Careful attack into a weaker Twin Strike. And if you look at what some of the arena style feats do for Twin Strike in melee, Careful Attack is still quite the underdog in that department as well. So, can you think of some other abilities that might turn Sure Strike and Careful attack into interesting (if not optimal) options? [/QUOTE]

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