Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Re-examining Sure Strike and Careful Attack
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 4663434" data-attributes="member: 2011"><p>Yes, they are circumstantial. That's a major portion of the game.</p><p></p><p>If you drop circumstantial, you aren't talking about the game.</p><p></p><p>And actually, most of the circumstantial synergy bonuses are not available to PCs at level one or are not available as frequently at level one (e.g. combat advantage happens a lot more at higher levels than at low levels due to powers that give it, and due to more shifts and slides).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Precisely.</p><p></p><p>Here are the defenses and types of the 29th and 30th level monsters in the MM:</p><p></p><p>Lvl 29, AC 43, Fort 48, Reflex 40, Will 45, Average Def. 44, Elite, Godforged Colossus</p><p>Lvl 29, AC 45, Fort 45, Reflex 43, Will 41, Average Def. 43.5, Solo, Runescribed Dracolich</p><p>Lvl 30, AC 43, Fort 49, Reflex 38, Will 32, Average Def. 40.5, Solo, Tarrasque</p><p>Lvl 30, AC 48, Fort 48, Reflex 43, Will 42, Average Def. 45.25, Solo, Ancient Red Dragon</p><p></p><p>The reason the defenses are so high is because these creatures are elites and solos. But, the solos here have a weakness of Will Def and the Elite has a weakness of Reflex (the Tarrasque has both weaknesses).</p><p></p><p>Yup. The Fighter might have a hard time with these creatures. That is why the game system has a Defender, a Leader, a Striker, and a Controller concept. Each role will be less effective against certain monsters and monster groups.</p><p></p><p>That's balance. Which monster groups a given role is effective against is circumstance.</p><p></p><p></p><p>There are many examples of powers that give bonuses to attack rolls. Bless is a second level power. It does not exist at first level. It gives a +1 bonus to all attack rolls until the end of the encounter. If the 30th level Cleric is fighting an Ancient Red Dragon and has Bless available, it would be a good choice of a power at some point in the encounter.</p><p></p><p>There are 6 Cleric, 1 Fighter, 2 Paladin, 2 Ranger, 1 Rogue, 2 Warlock, and 7 Warlord powers that give a bonus to hit. There are PrC powers and abilities that give bonuses to hit. There are feats that give circumstantial bonuses to hit. There are powers and item powers that give a penalty to enemy defenses or give combat advantage to an ally.</p><p></p><p>If the defenses of the creatures did not rise slightly faster than the "raw stats" of the PCs, then high level would be a joke. And as more and more splat books come out, it would become more and more of a joke as even more ways to change the odds become available.</p><p></p><p>But, one cannot look at it in the sterile glass bubble of raw stats only.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="KarinsDad, post: 4663434, member: 2011"] Yes, they are circumstantial. That's a major portion of the game. If you drop circumstantial, you aren't talking about the game. And actually, most of the circumstantial synergy bonuses are not available to PCs at level one or are not available as frequently at level one (e.g. combat advantage happens a lot more at higher levels than at low levels due to powers that give it, and due to more shifts and slides). Precisely. Here are the defenses and types of the 29th and 30th level monsters in the MM: Lvl 29, AC 43, Fort 48, Reflex 40, Will 45, Average Def. 44, Elite, Godforged Colossus Lvl 29, AC 45, Fort 45, Reflex 43, Will 41, Average Def. 43.5, Solo, Runescribed Dracolich Lvl 30, AC 43, Fort 49, Reflex 38, Will 32, Average Def. 40.5, Solo, Tarrasque Lvl 30, AC 48, Fort 48, Reflex 43, Will 42, Average Def. 45.25, Solo, Ancient Red Dragon The reason the defenses are so high is because these creatures are elites and solos. But, the solos here have a weakness of Will Def and the Elite has a weakness of Reflex (the Tarrasque has both weaknesses). Yup. The Fighter might have a hard time with these creatures. That is why the game system has a Defender, a Leader, a Striker, and a Controller concept. Each role will be less effective against certain monsters and monster groups. That's balance. Which monster groups a given role is effective against is circumstance. There are many examples of powers that give bonuses to attack rolls. Bless is a second level power. It does not exist at first level. It gives a +1 bonus to all attack rolls until the end of the encounter. If the 30th level Cleric is fighting an Ancient Red Dragon and has Bless available, it would be a good choice of a power at some point in the encounter. There are 6 Cleric, 1 Fighter, 2 Paladin, 2 Ranger, 1 Rogue, 2 Warlock, and 7 Warlord powers that give a bonus to hit. There are PrC powers and abilities that give bonuses to hit. There are feats that give circumstantial bonuses to hit. There are powers and item powers that give a penalty to enemy defenses or give combat advantage to an ally. If the defenses of the creatures did not rise slightly faster than the "raw stats" of the PCs, then high level would be a joke. And as more and more splat books come out, it would become more and more of a joke as even more ways to change the odds become available. But, one cannot look at it in the sterile glass bubble of raw stats only. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Re-examining Sure Strike and Careful Attack
Top