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<blockquote data-quote="Cognomen's Cassowary" data-source="post: 6874048" data-attributes="member: 6801445"><p>The damage and the effect are applied within the same sentence of the spell's description. There is no rules-based reason to believe that they are applied at different times.</p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p>And uncanny dodge has a specified timing, "when you are hit by an attack" (to paraphrase).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You could have done the same with shield, until ProphetSword posted the passage from the DMG explicitly stating that the shield spell is "<em>clear</em>" about being able to interrupt the triggering attack, that trigger being "when you are hit by an attack." The same passage tells us that shield is only an example for a "rule of thumb" for how to handle reaction timing. It sounds like you are saying that you will not apply that rule of thumb until it is made obsolete by an official adjudication of each reaction's interaction with its possible triggers.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Hriston, whether a reaction interrupts or not has nothing to do with its effect. Let me say that a fourth time: whether a reaction interrupts or not has nothing to do with its effect. It is a matter of the timing. An opportunity attack interrupts the enemy's movement because it is triggered by the enemy moving out of range, not because the effect of an opportunity attack is to interrupt movement. Shield interrupts an attack not because of the effect of the shield spell but because its timing allows it to be used "when you are hit". The interruption is not the "countering" effect of shield; the interruption is the stop in the normal flow of events caused by the timing of the reaction. Uncanny dodge is triggered in the same way as shield and therefore interrupts in the same way as shield, even if it does not "counter" in the same way that shield does.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Anyway, I find the rule of thumb offered by the DMG definitive enough. I don't really think that there's an interesting rules question here anymore, so I'm probably going to let this be my last post on the subject. Thanks for a good conversation, everyone, stay in school, eat your vegetables, and obey your DM.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Cognomen's Cassowary, post: 6874048, member: 6801445"] The damage and the effect are applied within the same sentence of the spell's description. There is no rules-based reason to believe that they are applied at different times. And uncanny dodge has a specified timing, "when you are hit by an attack" (to paraphrase). You could have done the same with shield, until ProphetSword posted the passage from the DMG explicitly stating that the shield spell is "[I]clear[/I]" about being able to interrupt the triggering attack, that trigger being "when you are hit by an attack." The same passage tells us that shield is only an example for a "rule of thumb" for how to handle reaction timing. It sounds like you are saying that you will not apply that rule of thumb until it is made obsolete by an official adjudication of each reaction's interaction with its possible triggers. Hriston, whether a reaction interrupts or not has nothing to do with its effect. Let me say that a fourth time: whether a reaction interrupts or not has nothing to do with its effect. It is a matter of the timing. An opportunity attack interrupts the enemy's movement because it is triggered by the enemy moving out of range, not because the effect of an opportunity attack is to interrupt movement. Shield interrupts an attack not because of the effect of the shield spell but because its timing allows it to be used "when you are hit". The interruption is not the "countering" effect of shield; the interruption is the stop in the normal flow of events caused by the timing of the reaction. Uncanny dodge is triggered in the same way as shield and therefore interrupts in the same way as shield, even if it does not "counter" in the same way that shield does. Anyway, I find the rule of thumb offered by the DMG definitive enough. I don't really think that there's an interesting rules question here anymore, so I'm probably going to let this be my last post on the subject. Thanks for a good conversation, everyone, stay in school, eat your vegetables, and obey your DM. [/QUOTE]
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