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Ready action gamebreaking situations
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<blockquote data-quote="radira" data-source="post: 6751092" data-attributes="member: 6803408"><p>This.</p><p></p><p>Readied action is actually the broadest action defined in whole d20 and it indeed interrupts actions in the middle, if you choose to do so except some few isolated instances of heavy handed balance (ex. trip locking with AoO). Since its such a special type of action, it is actually very prone to abuse. Lets say taken actions in d20 can be changed if something went south, which action type will you be able to use after you change them? since you already used your charge action as a Full Round action, will you take it as a move action because you just moved? Not to mention charges should be in a straight line so you can't bend it to another direction to strike someone else.</p><p></p><p></p><p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: #000000"> Don't think so, the intended action of A was to continually hit B without getting hit in return. In my scenario sure he can hit B with a full but OP's case was not that thus it's irrelevant and even if he choose to do so he earned it with its higher initiative roll anyways, he could've just charged in the first round, thats not the planned gain.</span></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: #000000"></span></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: #000000"></span><span style="color: #000000"></span></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: #000000"></span></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: #000000">You're right, logically ofc, but we have clear depiction of first case since that is the ready action by definition and it is it's intended use, but the latter case is not taking place. B moved, B attacked <em>check</em>, A didn't declare her ready as "when B damages me". This is a game and games have mechanical limitations. I just wanted to clarify that d20 have a solution for the mentioned case within its game rules.</span></p> <p style="text-align: left"><span style="color: #000000"></span></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Hmm i get what you say, it may not be a solid case as i thought in the first place, but i think you're misinterpreting the <em>during</em> part. Consider this, game wise its under misc actions, if you check "action types" in d20srd or pfsrd, you'll find nothing called misc type action under "action types" so we're clear it has its own set of rules to play, very unlike other structered types of actions and it has no mention of how much time it takes to do one. This leds to confusion, can you do it while doing other declared stuff since its not stated how much time it takes? You can also take immediate actions while you're doing other actions without declaring them outright and check d20srd, Table: Miscellaneous Actions, you will find 5-ft step is <u>under <em><strong>no action</strong></em></u><u> part</u> of misc actions.</p><p></p><p> In any case , you can declare every single attack action like this : Attack the enemy while taking 5-ft step <em>towards </em>it (in this case A or just pointing her grid). If she moves, you can move with her, if she does not, then it would be like trying to move towards a wall, it would fail since the wall is not moving. </p><p></p><p>Now i don't want to open a new topic about taking a move action towards a solid wall since it is prohibited to take a move to a grid which is impassable or occupied when you declared it in the first place but when you're GM, interpreting the actions, visualizing to players the 6 seconds and one of the said players insists on doing this, you will not reply "you cannot take this action" rather you say "you tried (ability drain : int) but failed miserably". If this applies, you can automatically assume every attack action is going to be taken this way from now on and no need to mention it like you don't mention you were attacking and also breathe a lot in the middle while flexing your muscles to raise your favored weapon in your left hand, vertically, to bash it on your foes head.</p><p></p><p>Even declaring beforehand like you mentioned works, consider this: A declares where to take 5-ft while readying, before B, so if B should declare where to 5-ft, A should too. B can easily see (also hear if A is a player, Metagaming) and declare a full attack <em>while</em> making a 5-foot towards A, since B knew A was going to backoff. Think of it like bracing against charge, it is also a ready action. If charger wouldn't knew the enemy has a spear in his hand and bracing, bracing would be something that everyone uses instead of how it is now <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool :cool:" data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" />.</p><p> </p><p>Edit : Also this is not easily foiled as you suggest, it really limits the melee only fighter type plus I can think of countless encounters that can be ruined by this since you are FORCED to take another action, this can be distruptive as being forced to take a specific action.</p><p></p><p>Sorry for the wall of text and my english!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="radira, post: 6751092, member: 6803408"] This. Readied action is actually the broadest action defined in whole d20 and it indeed interrupts actions in the middle, if you choose to do so except some few isolated instances of heavy handed balance (ex. trip locking with AoO). Since its such a special type of action, it is actually very prone to abuse. Lets say taken actions in d20 can be changed if something went south, which action type will you be able to use after you change them? since you already used your charge action as a Full Round action, will you take it as a move action because you just moved? Not to mention charges should be in a straight line so you can't bend it to another direction to strike someone else. [LEFT][COLOR=#000000] Don't think so, the intended action of A was to continually hit B without getting hit in return. In my scenario sure he can hit B with a full but OP's case was not that thus it's irrelevant and even if he choose to do so he earned it with its higher initiative roll anyways, he could've just charged in the first round, thats not the planned gain. [/COLOR][COLOR=#000000] You're right, logically ofc, but we have clear depiction of first case since that is the ready action by definition and it is it's intended use, but the latter case is not taking place. B moved, B attacked [I]check[/I], A didn't declare her ready as "when B damages me". This is a game and games have mechanical limitations. I just wanted to clarify that d20 have a solution for the mentioned case within its game rules. [/COLOR][/LEFT] Hmm i get what you say, it may not be a solid case as i thought in the first place, but i think you're misinterpreting the [I]during[/I] part. Consider this, game wise its under misc actions, if you check "action types" in d20srd or pfsrd, you'll find nothing called misc type action under "action types" so we're clear it has its own set of rules to play, very unlike other structered types of actions and it has no mention of how much time it takes to do one. This leds to confusion, can you do it while doing other declared stuff since its not stated how much time it takes? You can also take immediate actions while you're doing other actions without declaring them outright and check d20srd, Table: Miscellaneous Actions, you will find 5-ft step is [U]under [I][B]no action[/B][/I][/U][U] part[/U] of misc actions. In any case , you can declare every single attack action like this : Attack the enemy while taking 5-ft step [I]towards [/I]it (in this case A or just pointing her grid). If she moves, you can move with her, if she does not, then it would be like trying to move towards a wall, it would fail since the wall is not moving. Now i don't want to open a new topic about taking a move action towards a solid wall since it is prohibited to take a move to a grid which is impassable or occupied when you declared it in the first place but when you're GM, interpreting the actions, visualizing to players the 6 seconds and one of the said players insists on doing this, you will not reply "you cannot take this action" rather you say "you tried (ability drain : int) but failed miserably". If this applies, you can automatically assume every attack action is going to be taken this way from now on and no need to mention it like you don't mention you were attacking and also breathe a lot in the middle while flexing your muscles to raise your favored weapon in your left hand, vertically, to bash it on your foes head. Even declaring beforehand like you mentioned works, consider this: A declares where to take 5-ft while readying, before B, so if B should declare where to 5-ft, A should too. B can easily see (also hear if A is a player, Metagaming) and declare a full attack [I]while[/I] making a 5-foot towards A, since B knew A was going to backoff. Think of it like bracing against charge, it is also a ready action. If charger wouldn't knew the enemy has a spear in his hand and bracing, bracing would be something that everyone uses instead of how it is now :cool:. Edit : Also this is not easily foiled as you suggest, it really limits the melee only fighter type plus I can think of countless encounters that can be ruined by this since you are FORCED to take another action, this can be distruptive as being forced to take a specific action. Sorry for the wall of text and my english! [/QUOTE]
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