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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dremmen" data-source="post: 3327969" data-attributes="member: 30977">So that's the second jab you took at my gaming experience. I have had games with rogues in them, as well as played rogues myself. The BAB on the Rogue is decent, but usually not enough to sacrifice for Power Attack unless you play in really high level games and then the damage from Sneak Attack overshadows whatever you can add from Power Attack anyways. The AC on most NPCs will only decrease by a point, maybe two, when you take away their Dex when you catch them by surprise. A 5th level Rogue, with a BAB of +3, and say another +2 from Weapon Finesse, has only a +5 to hit say a guardsman with Chainmail AC 15. That's 50/50 that you hit him even flat footed, and you are planning on diverting that to Power Attack for a point or two more damage? So really, I'm not making it up. Rogues in my experience don't take Power Attack, they take Quick Draw, Improved Init, Point Blank Shot and Wpn Finesse. Not saying that you sohuldn't take Power Attack as a Rogue, you take whatever floats your boat, but players that I've run games for don't spend their few feats on Power Attack. The trend is ranged sneak attacks using Point Blank Shot and Rapid Shot in the last couple of games actually, very annoying if my thugs can't Spot them. Me personally I like to multiclass Rogue with a Cleric to deliver stabs with touch spells to the back of victims using some feat a friend picked up out of one of the sourcebooks.Now, if you could so kindly quit attacking my experience at gaming, which is not in question in this particular thread, I'd appreciate.True, but there are some abstractions DMs are not comfortable with. That's why personally I play with the Game of Thrones D20 rules, which are more like Grim and Gritty, making the PCs using Buy the Points, using Elements of Magic for my magic system, and a couple of house rules for armor piercing effects of missile weapons at close range, the above mentioned skill based damage bonus, and the Torn Asunder Critical Hits rules. Granted, I adopted them over time, but so far it is what I'm happy with for my abstraction. Getting back to the original idea of a skill-based in crease in damage, it adds to game speed by allowing high level characters to mow down low level thugs so no heroics lost there, while if the PC is unarmored and facing that crossbow, even from a low level character, because the damage added comes from the discrepancy between the To Hit roll and the AC, it is possible for that bolt to really hurt. And the PC would be forced to get crafty, instead of cocky. And that's all that I am looking for - a sense of vulnerability, even at high levels. I will grant that a high level PC, in armor, in front of said low level PC with a crossbow CAN be cocky, because there is about no chance any additional damage would be delivered then, but if the system was perfect then I wouldn't be blurbing it out in the forum, I'd be marketing it. It helps, it doesn't fix.Edit: By the by, this simple house rule of skill based damage bonus also makes the high level monk character actually dangerous. Where in every game I've been a part of monks begin to lag in the ability to do serious damage in comparison to the rest of the party at around 6th level and up. They hit every time but even with bonuses and extra dice the damge they do is minimal. However their really high To Hit bonuses and multiple attacks, combined with the additional damage based on skill house rule, makes them lethal weapons.</blockquote>

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